【BBC商业新闻】20261110 Business Tod
字幕摘录
| 时间 | 英文 | 中文 |
|---|---|---|
| 0:06 | The chips are down. | 筹码掉了 |
| 0:08 | NVIDIA在CEOJensen Huang承认他有外遇后 启动了调查 | |
| 0:13 | with a suspected Chinese spy. | 与涉嫌中国间谍. |
| 0:16 | The news is cold comfort for investors who are on edge | 这消息对陷入困境的投资者来说是冷酷的安慰 |
| 0:20 | following last week's massive tech sell-off. | 上周技术大卖之后 |
| 0:22 | Today we're seeing a rebound in Asia, but | 今天亚洲出现反弹,但 |
| 0:25 | for how long? | 多长时间? |
| 0:27 | Oil prices dip as Trump says further attacks against Iran are unlikely | 如特朗普所说, 对伊朗的进一步攻击不太可能, |
| 0:31 | despite a hooty strike on Saudi Aramco's offices. | 尽管沙特石油公司的办公室遭到袭击。 |
| 0:35 | And caught on camera as shoplifting surges in the UK, | 被摄像头拍到了 在英国的店铺里 |
展开字幕全文（435 条）
| 序号 | 英文 | 中文 |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | The chips are down. | 筹码掉了 |
| 2 | NVIDIA在CEOJensen Huang承认他有外遇后 启动了调查 | |
| 3 | with a suspected Chinese spy. | 与涉嫌中国间谍. |
| 4 | The news is cold comfort for investors who are on edge | 这消息对陷入困境的投资者来说是冷酷的安慰 |
| 5 | following last week's massive tech sell-off. | 上周技术大卖之后 |
| 6 | Today we're seeing a rebound in Asia, but | 今天亚洲出现反弹,但 |
| 7 | for how long? | 多长时间? |
| 8 | Oil prices dip as Trump says further attacks against Iran are unlikely | 如特朗普所说, 对伊朗的进一步攻击不太可能, |
| 9 | despite a hooty strike on Saudi Aramco's offices. | 尽管沙特石油公司的办公室遭到袭击。 |
| 10 | And caught on camera as shoplifting surges in the UK, | 被摄像头拍到了 在英国的店铺里 |
| 11 | we look at the new tech helping one major supermarket crack down on retail crime. | 我们看看新的技术 帮助一个主要的超市 打击零售犯罪。 |
| 12 | Welcome, you're with Business Today in London with me, Sally Bundock. | 欢迎,你今天在伦敦与我合作,莎莉・邦多克 |
| 13 | So we start with the bombshell | 我们从炸弹壳开始 |
| 14 | revelations involving NVIDIA's chief executive. | NVIDIA首席执行官的揭发 |
| 15 | The tech giant, one of the most valuable in the | 技术巨头,最有价值的之一 |
| 16 | world, has launched an investigation into claims that Jensen Huang had an affair with a woman | 黄詹森和女人有染 |
| 17 | suspected of spying for China. | 涉嫌为中国间谍 |
| 18 | The chipmaker said it has no reason to believe its secrets or US | 芯片制造者说它没有理由相信它的秘密或美国 |
| 19 | national security were compromised and that the CEO was committed to continuing to lead the company. | 国家安全受到损害,首席执行官承诺继续领导该公司。 |
| 20 | In an email to staff, Jensen Huang said he took full responsibility for what he did, | 在一封给员工的邮件中,黄詹森说他对自己的所作所为承担了全部责任, |
| 21 | adding that he had fallen short of his responsibilities to NVIDIA's employees, | 补充说,他没有履行对NVIDIA雇员的责任, |
| 22 | board and shareholders. | 董事会和股东。 |
| 23 | Under Mr. Huang's 30-year leadership, the company has become | 在黄先生三十年的带领下 公司变成了 |
| 24 | a key producer of the hardware used in emerging AI technologies. | 在新兴AI技术中使用的硬件的主要生产商. |
| 25 | What could these revelations mean | 这些启示意味着什么? |
| 26 | for the future of the company? | 为了公司的未来? |
| 27 | Here's the view of one analyst, Patrick Moorhead, who's founder and | 以下是一位分析师帕特里克·莫尔黑德的观点,他是创始人和 |
| 28 | of more insights and strategy. | 更深刻的见解和战略 |
| 29 | We have to separate the short term from the long term. | 我们必须把短期与长期分开。 |
| 30 | I mean, short | 我是说,很短 |
| 31 | term, there's going to be no impact. | 术语,不会有影响。 |
| 32 | And then long term is really going to be based on the | 然后,长期 将真正要基于 |
| 33 | board investigation and also what comes out of the foreign affairs, China and intelligence house | 董事会调查 以及外交、中国和情报机构 |
| 34 | chairs at a meeting November 18th. | 在11月18日的会议上主持会议。 |
| 35 | And we also have to separate impact on the stock versus impact | 我们还得把对股票的影响 和对股票的影响分开 |
| 36 | on the company itself. | 在公司本身。 |
| 37 | The company has three generations of technology roadmap that has been | 该公司有三代技术路线图 |
| 38 | decided on is in there. | 决定就在里面。 |
| 39 | And NVIDIA has a very competent team of leaders to be able to execute | NVIDIA有一个非常胜任的领导团队 能够执行 |
| 40 | that. | 那个 |
| 41 | Now, if something does come out that says there were some improprieties related to national | 现在,如果真的有什么 说有一些不正之风 与国民 |
| 42 | security or that Megaspeed was given favors, we could see Jensen Huang leave the company | 保安,或者说巨速公司得到了帮助 我们可以看见黄詹森离开公司 |
| 43 | and that would definitely leave a mark. | 这绝对会留下痕迹 |
| 44 | Well, Megaspeed is the company that's based in | 巨速是总部所在的公司 |
| 45 | Singapore. | 新加坡. |
| 46 | Alice Huang is an executive of the company and it's reported Jensen Huang had had | 黄爱丽丝是公司的经理 据报导黄杰森有 |
| 47 | a romantic relationship with her. | 跟她的浪漫关系 |
| 48 | 我们跟Anna McDonald谈谈 投资战略总监 | |
| 49 | Grieves lands down and a good morning to you. | 格里夫斯下来了,早上好 |
| 50 | So this as as more detail emerges, this becomes | 因此,随着更多细节的出现, |
| 51 | more and more complicated. | 越来越复杂了 |
| 52 | And at the moment, NVIDIA, the company and President Trump are | 目前,NVIDIA公司和川普总统 |
| 53 | saying they are supporting Jensen Huang whilst an independent investigation is ongoing. | 说他们支持黄詹森 而独立调查正在进行中 |
| 54 | Yeah, | 对 |
| 55 | exactly. | 没错 |
| 56 | So we will wait to see what that independent investigation comes out with. | 因此,我们将等待看看独立调查的结果。 |
| 57 | It does highlight, I guess, that Jensen Huang has been critical in bringing about this company, | 这确实凸显出,我猜, Jensen Huang 一直批评这家公司 |
| 58 | which started off as a games chip for the video gaming sector. | 最初是作为游戏游戏的芯片 |
| 59 | And then other people realized it | 然后其他人意识到了 |
| 60 | would be fantastic for training large language models. | 对于训练大型语言模型来说是很棒的。 |
| 61 | So it's been absolutely at the forefront | 所以它绝对处于前列 |
| 62 | of the AI trade and so successful and so cash generative that actually they are now involved | 和如此成功 和如此现金的基因, 他们现在实际参与 |
| 63 | with finance in quite a lot of other companies. | 在很多其他公司里都有资金 |
| 64 | So it really is a very key, key part of the whole | 所以这真的是整个过程中的关键 |
| 65 | of the whole AI trade. | 整个AI贸易。 |
| 66 | And there's been lots of issues around protecting US national security | 还有很多保护美国国家安全的问题 |
| 67 | and protecting US superiority in the race for AI by trying to restrict the number of | 并保护美国在争取大赦国际的竞赛中的优越性,试图限制 |
| 68 | of the of the most most developed chips that can go to China. | 最发达的芯片可以去中国 |
| 69 | So this really is quite a sort of key | 所以这真的是很关键的 |
| 70 | Oh, it certainly is. | 哦,这当然是。 |
| 71 | And as you say, NVIDIA is sort of the center of the AI story in the US and it's | 正如你所说 NVIDIA是美国AI故事的中心 |
| 72 | sort of driving the ecosystem as it were. | 一种驱动生态系统的原样。 |
| 73 | And he is very much the visionary, the man who had the | 他非常有远见 拥有 |
| 74 | ideas some 30 years ago, and has really driven this company to the point of a four trillion dollar | 30年前的想法, 并真正推动这家公司 到四万亿美元 |
| 75 | valuation. | 估价。 |
| 76 | Now the question is, if he has got to step down as a consequence of this, who would | 现在的问题是,如果他因为这个而不得不下台,谁会 |
| 77 | take over and what would that mean for the the AI industry in the US? | 这对美国的AI行业意味着什么? |
| 78 | He has a very flat management structure with 60 direct reports, and he credits that with being | 他有一个非常平坦的管理结构,有60份直接报告,他赞扬这一点: |
| 79 | able to give very, you know, gives those 60 direct reports huge amounts of power to go and get things | 给这60个直接报告 巨大的权力 去得到的东西 |
| 80 | done. | 结束了。 |
| 81 | But he has been, I guess, the decision maker and he's been close to Trump as well in terms of | 但是,我想,他一直是决策者 他一直接近特朗普 |
| 82 | allowing certain chips to be sold to China. | 允许某些芯片出售给中国。 |
| 83 | So he, you know, if he weren't there, I'm sure his | 所以他,你知道, 如果他不在那里, 我相信他的 |
| 84 | absence would be very much felt because there isn't an absolute successor in place. | 因为没有绝对的继任者, |
| 85 | However, | 不过, |
| 86 | I mean, this is a huge company. | 我的意思是,这是一个巨大的公司。 |
| 87 | They will have been considering this at any time one considers | 他们随时都会考虑的 |
| 88 | keep key person risk. | 保持关键人物的风险。 |
| 89 | So I think that whilst this will be unsettling, the initial impacts, | 因此,我认为,虽然这将 不安,最初的影响, |
| 90 | I think, will probably be quite limited. | 我认为,可能相当有限。 |
| 91 | And they're more around how do investors feel about | 他们更在投资者的感受 |
| 92 | the whole AI trade in itself. | 整个AI交易本身。 |
| 93 | We've got numbers from Nvidia next week, which people will be | 我们有Nvidia的号码 下周,人们将会是 |
| 94 | looking at incredibly closely, perhaps even more closely now. | 仔细观察,也许现在更仔细 |
| 95 | Anna, thank you so much. | 安娜,非常感谢 |
| 96 | Anna | 甊 |
| 97 | McDonald, they're from Hargreaves, Lansdowne. | 麦当劳,他们来自哈格里夫斯,兰斯当。 |
| 98 | {\fn黑体\fs22\bord1\shad0\3aHBE\4aH00\fscx67\fscy66\2cHFFFFFF\3cH808080}只是说中国拒绝了要求 | |
| 99 | it's involved in industrial espionage against Nvidia. | 它参与工业间谍 对Nvidia。 |
| 100 | Let's not forget that President Trump | 别忘了川普总统 |
| 101 | will be headed to China later this month for the APEC summit. | 本月晚些时候将前往中国参加亚太经合组织首脑会议。 |
| 102 | And the crisis engulfing Nvidia | 席卷恩维迪亚的危机 |
| 103 | comes at what is a very difficult time for the tech industry in general. | 技术产业现在非常困难 |
| 104 | Stocks linked to AI | 与大赦国际有关的库存 |
| 105 | fell sharply on both Thursday and Friday following the Democrats' win control of | 在民主党获胜后 周四和周五都急剧下降 |
| 106 | Congress in the midterms. | 国会在中期。 |
| 107 | And they have vowed to crack down on the building of data centers | 他们发誓要摧毁数据中心的建设 |
| 108 | in the United States. | 在美国。 |
| 109 | So markets, though, seem to be starting the week, certainly in Asia, | 所以市场,虽然, 似乎开始一个星期, 当然在亚洲, |
| 110 | on a bit of a rebound from some of the heavy losses we saw in Asia at the end of last week. | 上周末我们在亚洲看到的一些重大损失 有点反弹 |
| 111 | So the Nikkei is currently up around 2.5%. | 所以Nikkei号目前上升了2.5%左右. |
| 112 | Let's talk to Mark Mahoney, who's its senior | 我们去找马克・马奥尼,他是他的高级 |
| 113 | managing director and head of internet research at Evercore ISI. | 担任ISIEvercore公司总经理和互联网研究负责人。 |
| 114 | Good to have you on the program, | 很高兴你能参加节目 |
| 115 | Mark. | 马克 |
| 116 | Good to be here. | 很高兴来到这里。 |
| 117 | What do you expect the reaction might be to this Nvidia story that's | 你觉得Nvidia的故事有什么反应? |
| 118 | sort of emerging over the weekend when Wall Street opens later? | 周末华尔街晚点开业? |
| 119 | Oh, I'm not sure. | 哦,我还不确定 |
| 120 | I don't | 我没有 |
| 121 | 把Nvidia当作股票 | |
| 122 | It's an unusual event, maybe not unprecedented. | 这是一个不寻常的事件,也许不是前所未有的。 |
| 123 | I think it will just | 我认为它只是 |
| 124 | cause more question marks than anything else. | 问号比其他任何东西都多 |
| 125 | But I think the much bigger news for the market is | 但我认为市场最大的消息是 |
| 126 | going to be the news from last week and concerns about whether the data center build out will | 将会是上周的新闻 并担心数据中心是否建成 |
| 127 | maybe not be stalled, but will at least be slowed or made more expensive. | 可能不会停滞不前,但至少会放慢速度或增加费用。 |
| 128 | And so with that in mind, | 因此,考虑到这一点, |
| 129 | what will happen with share prices this week? | 这周股价会怎样? |
| 130 | I mean, was that just a sort of knee-jerk | 我的意思是,这只是一种膝盖球 |
| 131 | sell-off that we saw at the end of last week and we're done there? | 我们上周末看到的卖掉 然后就结束了? |
| 132 | Or is this actually a | 或者这其实是一个 |
| 133 | trend that could last for longer? | 可能持续更长的时间? |
| 134 | My guess is that it's not a trend that will last for longer, | 我猜,这不是一个趋势 将持续更长, |
| 135 | but there's a series of things that will move the markets and the tech stocks, including | 但有一系列的东西 将移动市场和技术股票,包括 |
| 136 | in the direction of interest rates, including the direction of oil, et cetera, et cetera. | 利率方向,包括石油方向等。 |
| 137 | But the one clear message or one of the clear messages from the elections in the U.S. last week | 但上星期美国大选发出明确的信息 |
| 138 | was I think there were 41 local referendums on data centers and 40 of them were cautious. | 我认为有41个地方的 数据中心公投 其中有40个是谨慎的 |
| 139 | We're | 我们是 |
| 140 | trying to slow down the development of data centers. | 试图减缓数据中心的发展。 |
| 141 | So I don't know that any data centers | 所以,我不知道 任何数据中心 |
| 142 | under construction currently are going to get stopped. | 目前正在建设中,目前将停止。 |
| 143 | Whether this slows down the permitting | 这是否减缓了许可 |
| 144 | for future data centers, I think that's a much greater probability or just requires the industry | 对于未来的数据中心, 我认为这是一个更大的概率 或者只是需要行业 |
| 145 | participants to come up with much better compromises with local authorities. | 与地方当局达成更好的妥协。 |
| 146 | Who's going | 谁去 |
| 147 | to cover the externalities, the impact on power, the impact on water usage, any environmental | 包括外在因素、对电力的影响、对用水的影响、 |
| 148 | impacts? | 撞击? |
| 149 | I think all of that can get negotiated over time and hopefully it'll be done in a way | 我想这一切可以经过一段时间的谈判 希望能够以某种方式完成 |
| 150 | that's fair to all the parties involved. | 这对有关各方都是公平的 |
| 151 | But that's my guess as to what will happen. | 但我猜会发生什么 |
| 152 | It seems | 看起来 |
| 153 | to me like we're at peak AI data center fear now. | 对我来说,就像我们现在在顶峰 AI数据中心的恐惧。 |
| 154 | My guess is we won't be here 12 months from now, | 我猜我们不会在这里 12个月后, |
| 155 | but it depends on what products and solutions some of the AI companies come up with. | 但要看AI公司想出什么产品和解决方案 |
| 156 | So from what I'm reading between the lines of what you're saying there, Mark, that your | 所以,从我读到的行间 你在说什么,马克,你的 |
| 157 | overall, as far as financial markets are concerned, yes, we will see some turbulence, | 总的来说,就金融市场而言,是的,我们将看到一些动荡, |
| 158 | but we're not looking at a kind of AI bust story here. | 但是我们不是在看AI的破故事 |
| 159 | I don't think so. | 亦不见. |
| 160 | AI bust story sounds | AI 短篇小说 |
| 161 | pretty extreme. | 相当极端。 |
| 162 | It's possible something like that happens. | 可能发生这种事 |
| 163 | I don't think so. | 亦不见. |
| 164 | I think you've got too | 我想你也一样 |
| 165 | many companies that have been investing in this substantially. | 许多公司为此投入了大量资金。 |
| 166 | Look, it's a massive investment | 你看,这是一个巨大的投资 |
| 167 | cycle. | 循环。 |
| 168 | It's over a trillion in capital expenditures that's being spent by some of the largest | 超过一万亿的资本支出 被一些最大的 |
| 169 | companies in the world, Microsoft, Amazon, Google, Meta, Oracle. | 世界的公司,微软,亚马逊,谷歌,Meta,甲骨文. |
| 170 | So it's like something we've never | 就像我们从未有过的 |
| 171 | seen before in terms of the magnitude of the investment spend. | 从投资支出的金额来看,这是以前的情况。 |
| 172 | But the number of the data | 但数据的数量 |
| 173 | points that we're getting on the other side on the returns on that investment spend are also | 我们从另一边得到的 投资支出回报率也 |
| 174 | starting to really pile up. | 开始堆积起来 |
| 175 | And what I'm specifically referring to is the year-over-year growth rates for | 我具体指的是 年复一年的增长率 |
| 176 | the hyperscalers, whether that's Microsoft, Amazon with its cloud business, Google with its cloud | 超大尺度的,不管那是微软,亚马逊的云层业务,谷歌的云层 |
| 177 | business, they're all showing materially accelerating revenue growth and ramping profitability in those | 他们都在物质上加速了收入增长 提高了利润率 |
| 178 | segments. | 部分。 |
| 179 | And so if that continues, I think the market will become more comfortable with the AI | 因此,如果这样继续下去,我认为市场会 更加舒适的AI |
| 180 | trade. | 贸易。 |
| 181 | OK, Mark Mahaney, thanks for explaining all of that. | 好吧,马克马哈尼,谢谢你解释这一切。 |
| 182 | Good to see you. | 很高兴见到你。 |
| 183 | Thank you, Sally. | 谢谢你,莎莉。 |
| 184 | Now, | 现在, |
| 185 | if we turn our attention to the Middle East, at the weekend, the Saudi Aramco Tower in Riyadh's | 如果我们把注意力转向中东, 在周末,沙特石油公司在利雅得的塔台 |
| 186 | financial district was hit by falling shrapnel in what the Saudi Arabia's Ministry of Energy says | 沙特阿拉伯能源部说,金融区被弹片掉落击中。 |
| 187 | was an attempted attack. | 是一次未遂袭击 |
| 188 | Yemen's Houthis say they carried out the attack and had also targeted the | 也门的胡塞人说,他们发动了这次袭击,并且还把目标对准了也门。 |
| 189 | airport in Riyadh and Aramco oil storage tanks. | 利雅得机场和Aramco储油罐。 |
| 190 | Meanwhile, President Trump on Sunday said he was | 与此同时,特朗普总统星期天说他 |
| 191 | highly unlikely to restart open war with Iran, but warned he could still strike the country as the | 极不可能重新开始与伊朗的公开战争,但警告说,他仍然可以像伊朗一样打击伊朗。 |
| 192 | U.S. tries to reach a deal with Iran to end the conflict. | 美国试图与伊朗达成协议以结束冲突. |
| 193 | Oil prices, of course, are reacting, | 当然,石油价格正在作出反应, |
| 194 | falling slightly in early trading today. | 今天在早期贸易中略有下降。 |
| 195 | A barrel of Brent is trading at around $97. | 一桶布伦特的交易价格是97美元左右. |
| 196 | Well, let's go live to Riyadh now and speak to John Sfakianakis, who's chief economist and | 好了,让我们去利雅得现场直播 现在和约翰・斯法基亚纳基斯说话, 他的首席经济学家和 |
| 197 | head of research at the Gulf Research Center. | 海湾研究中心研究负责人. |
| 198 | Good to talk to you again, John. | 很高兴再和你说话 约翰 |
| 199 | So we've mentioned | 所以我们提到 |
| 200 | there that President Trump is sort of calming down the rhetoric on his plans for Iran, but also | 川普总统正在平息 关于他为伊朗谋划的言论, |
| 201 | they've said a task force intended to blockade Iran's land borders is now in full effect. | 他们说,一个专案组打算封锁伊朗的陆地边界 现在完全生效。 |
| 202 | What is your reading on where we are? | 你读到我们在哪里? |
| 203 | Oh, well, nice to be with you, Sally, again. | 哦,好吧,很高兴和你在一起,莎莉,再次。 |
| 204 | Quite baffling for a lot of people, and we are in this gray zone where President Trump could | 对很多人来说,我们很困惑,我们处在一个灰色地带,特朗普总统可以 |
| 205 | decide to attack the region. | 决定攻击该地区。 |
| 206 | Of course, a lot of the regional players and decision makers are | 当然,许多区域行动者和决策者 |
| 207 | expecting some sort of an attack, so I will not be surprised. | 等待某种攻击, 所以我不会感到惊讶。 |
| 208 | Also, I'm not surprised with the | 而且,我并不惊讶 |
| 209 | rhetoric, the change of mind, of tone, also because of the impact of the midterm election, | 言论,思想的改变,语气的改变, 也因为中期选举的影响, |
| 210 | so a bit of politics is playing into the mix. | 所以,一些政治 正在发挥在混合。 |
| 211 | But there is a third aircraft carrier coming into the | 但还有第三艘航空母舰飞入 |
| 212 | region around the 18th, 19th of November, and that could change diametrically things in the Gulf. | 11月18日,19日左右,这可以改变海湾地区的方位。 |
| 213 | What is not changing is the attacks coming from the Houthis, and I think that's very essential. | 没有改变的是来自胡塞河的攻击 我认为这是非常重要的 |
| 214 | As you mentioned, both the airport and the Aramco Tower have been hit. | 正如你提到的,机场和Aramco塔都遭到袭击。 |
| 215 | Whether it's sharpened or not, | 无论是否磨磨 |
| 216 | that's a muted issue. | 这是一个哑巴问题。 |
| 217 | Still, it creates a kind of a noise about the impact of the war or at least | 不过,它制造了一种 关于战争的影响的噪音 或者至少 |
| 218 | the corollary and the whole issue concerning the attacks from Yemen. | 也门发动攻击的必然结果和整个问题。 |
| 219 | So quite concerning news, Sally. | 莎莉,关于新闻 |
| 220 | Yeah, concerning news, and I would imagine the entire region is on edge. | 是的,关于新闻, 我想整个地区都处于边缘。 |
| 221 | What are you hearing | 你们听到什么了? |
| 222 | about any conversations that might be going on behind the scenes? | 任何可能发生在幕后的对话? |
| 223 | We're told all the time that | 我们一直被告知 |
| 224 | there are various players from different sides talking about the possible end to all of this. | 有来自不同方面的不同角色 谈论这一切的可能结束。 |
| 225 | Yes, I mean, there is always an involvement, especially by certain countries such as Qatar, | 是的,我的意思是,总是有参与,特别是某些国家,如卡塔尔, |
| 226 | that wants to push ahead the diplomacy card. | 想要推进外交卡。 |
| 227 | But we've seen it before, whereby there is diplomacy, | 但我们以前见过 有外交 |
| 228 | and immediately a few hours later, there is war. | 几个小时后 战争就爆发了 |
| 229 | So it's really unpredictable. | 所以这是非常不可预测的。 |
| 230 | Yes, we do see more | 是的,我们看到了更多 |
| 231 | of a movement, many participants, Saudi, Qatar, the UAE. | 许多与会者、沙特、卡塔尔、阿联酋。 |
| 232 | However, Marco Rubio just a few hours | 然而,马可·鲁比奥仅仅几个小时 |
| 233 | ago said that he doesn't understand the position of Iran. | 之前说他不懂伊朗的立场 |
| 234 | And remember, Iran is not going to use | 记住,伊朗不会使用 |
| 235 | all this leeway to push ahead with their demands, and they will be far more aggressive. | 所有这一切余地 推进他们的要求, 并且他们将更具有攻击性。 |
| 236 | So it really | 原来如此 |
| 237 | depends on how the world and Trump especially wants to respond to this aggression. | 取决于世界和特朗普 如何特别想对这场侵略作出反应 |
| 238 | Okay, John, | 好吧,约翰, |
| 239 | thanks for talking to us again. | 谢谢你再次和我们交谈 |
| 240 | John Sfakianakis from the Gulf Research Center. | 来自海湾研究中心的约翰·斯法基亚纳基斯. |
| 241 | Still to come, | 还是要来 |
| 242 | AI and robots take center stage at the Web Summit in Lisbon. | AI和机器人在里斯本的网络峰会上占据中心位置. |
| 243 | But will the conference be overshadowed | 但会议会蒙羞吗? |
| 244 | by concerns over a tech slowdown? | 担心技术减速? |
| 245 | Around the world and across the UK, this is BBC News. | 环游世界和整个英国,这是英国广播公司新闻。 |
| 246 | 今天你和BBC新闻的Business Today合作 | |
| 247 | Representatives of more than 190 countries | 190多个国家的代表 |
| 248 | are gathering in Antalya in Turkey today for the start of COP 31 with the aim to find a global | 今天在土耳其的安塔利亚举行第三十一届缔约方会议,目的是找到一个全球性的 |
| 249 | consensus on how to prevent and deal with global warming. | 就如何防止和应对全球变暖达成共识。 |
| 250 | Australia will this year be leading | 澳大利亚今年将带头 |
| 251 | negotiations working closely with Pacific Island countries. | 与太平洋岛屿国家密切合作的谈判。 |
| 252 | There's a lot at stake with scientists | 科学家有太多的利害关系 |
| 253 | warning this year could be on course to be the hottest on record. | 警告今年有可能成为最热门的纪录 |
| 254 | Well, Sandhya Sabapathy is | 桑希娅·萨巴西是 |
| 255 | chief executive and founder of Kaleidoscope, a sustainability and business resilience company. | Kaleidoscope的首席执行官和创始人,一家可持续性和企业复原力公司。 |
| 256 | Good to have you with us on the programme. | 很高兴你加入我们的节目 |
| 257 | So with again with the US saying it will not be in | 所以美国说它不会进入 |
| 258 | at COP 31. | 在缔约方会议第三十一届会议上 |
| 259 | What is your hope for progress? | 你对进步有什么希望? |
| 260 | Thank you for having me. | 谢谢你邀请我 |
| 261 | The way I see it is that the | 我的看法是 |
| 262 | pledge era is over. | 质押时代结束了。 |
| 263 | It's now more about talking about the cost and companies and countries across | 现在更多的是谈论成本以及公司和国家 |
| 264 | the world that will win at COP 31 are going to be the ones that are not just talking about progress, | 在缔约方会议第三十一届会议上获胜的世界将不仅仅是谈论进步, |
| 265 | but actually showing live architecture and live progress in the area. | 但实际上展示了现场建筑 和现场的进步。 |
| 266 | The process in COP in general | 缔约方会议的一般进程 |
| 267 | has been in good tension quite a lot, but I'm of the belief that the core principle of negotiation | 一直很紧张 但我相信谈判的核心原则 |
| 268 | at COP is still pretty effective. | 在缔约方会议上仍然相当有效。 |
| 269 | However, smaller conferences like the Santa Marta one, | 但是,像圣玛尔塔那样的小型会议, |
| 270 | which was the fossil fuel phase out conference, were sometimes a bit more effective because you | 那是化石燃料淘汰大会,有时会更有效,因为你 |
| 271 | could talk about more pointed topics as well as have a smaller, maybe more voluntary set up to | 还可以讨论更尖锐的主题,以及设立一个较小的,也许更自愿的单位,以便 |
| 272 | progress. | 进展。 |
| 273 | So in my eyes, there is still a lot to be hopeful for, but it's a tough year when it comes | 所以在我眼里,仍然有很多希望, 但当它来临的时候,这是一个艰难的一年 |
| 274 | to COP 31. | 提交缔约方会议第三十一届会议的报告。 |
| 275 | Yeah, it's a very tough year because everyone is looking to see delivery on past | 是啊,这是一个非常艰难的一年 因为每个人都在寻找过去交付 |
| 276 | promises, which includes some 300 billion dollars a year in climate finance for poorer nations | 包括每年为穷国提供约3 000亿美元的气候融资 |
| 277 | by 2035. | 到2035年为止。 |
| 278 | That's a big number. | 这是一个很大的数字。 |
| 279 | 2035 is not that far away and yet we've got richer countries who | 2035年不是那么远 但我们有更富有的国家 |
| 280 | are having to divert funds that may have gone to climate to defence. | 不得不将可能用于气候的资金转用于防御。 |
| 281 | No, I fully agree with that | 不,我完全同意这一点 |
| 282 | and I think that one of the key bylines that we're hoping from this COP is that commitment | 我认为我们所希望的缔约方会议的关键旁白之一是承诺 |
| 283 | to the tripling of the adaptation finance number that you just mentioned and to have clear milestones | 你刚才提到的适应融资数字的三倍,并有明确的里程碑 |
| 284 | to that 2035 target because so far it has only been that high level target and the monetary | 2035年目标,因为到目前为止,它只是高水平的目标和货币 |
| 285 | instruments have not been developed quite yet. | 文书尚未制定。 |
| 286 | The other bits that I'm probably a bit keen on as | 其他的,我可能有点热衷于 |
| 287 | well is to figure out a bit more on the just transition mechanism. | 最好能多了解一下 公正的过渡机制。 |
| 288 | So how do we actually | 那么,我们如何实际 |
| 289 | upscale and re-scale workforces as they need to transition in these poorer countries, the global | 提高劳动力规模和重新增加劳动力规模,因为他们需要在这些较贫穷的国家,即全球 |
| 290 | south, into a much more cleaner economy? | 进入更清洁的经济吗? |
| 291 | And finally, the fossil fuel phase out, as I've | 最后,化石燃料的淘汰,因为我 |
| 292 | mentioned, it would be really great to actually see that in the final text as opposed to it just | 提到,如果能真正在最后文本中看到这一点,那就太好了。 |
| 293 | being a fringe conversation like it was in the past. | 像过去一样的闲聊 |
| 294 | Okay, Sandhya Sabapathy, thank you for talking | 好吧,桑希亚・萨巴萨,谢谢你的谈话 |
| 295 | to us and we'll keep across COP31 as it progresses. | 对我们来说,我们会保持整个COP31 随着它的进展。 |
| 296 | But if we turn to retail now in the UK, almost | 但是如果我们转向零售 现在在英国,几乎 |
| 297 | four in five shop workers have experienced abuse from the public in the past year, according to | 5个店员中有4个在过去一年中受到公众的虐待。 |
| 298 | new figures from the retail trust. | 新数字来自零售信托。 |
| 299 | Our retail correspondent Emma Simpson's been given exclusive | 我们的零售记者艾玛・辛普森 被授予独家 |
| 300 | access to Sainsbury's to find out how the supermarket giant is tackling this problem. | 了解超市巨头是如何解决这个问题的 |
| 301 | It doesn't get more brazen than this. | 它不会比这更无耻 |
| 302 | These two have dragged a wheelie bin into a supermarket | 这两个人把一个轮椅桶拖进了超市 |
| 303 | and are loading it up with booze and detergent. | 并装满了酒和洗涤剂。 |
| 304 | Shoplifting is rife everywhere. | 偷东西到处都是 |
| 305 | This pair walks | 这双腿走路 |
| 306 | straight out. | 直接出来。 |
| 307 | But retailers are fighting back. | 但零售商在反击。 |
| 308 | Facial recognition technology is one of the fastest | 脸部识别技术是最快的 |
| 309 | growing tools. | 不断增长的工具。 |
| 310 | It's being used at the Sainsbury's store in Whitechapel. | 正在白教堂的森斯伯里商店使用. |
| 311 | I've come to see and test | 我是来看和测试的 |
| 312 | how the system works. | 系统如何运作. |
| 313 | To do it, Sainsbury's has put me onto the watch list. | 为了做到这一点,森斯伯里已经把我列入监视名单。 |
| 314 | So as I go in, | 所以当我进去时 |
| 315 | that camera is scanning my face and comparing it with images of known offenders. | 摄影机正在扫描我的脸 并将其与已知罪犯的影像相比较 |
| 316 | Within seconds, | 在几秒钟之内, |
| 317 | an alert is being sent to staff in the store. | 通知店里的工作人员 |
| 318 | The system says it's a match. | 系统说相合. |
| 319 | I'm on the database of | 我在数据库里 |
| 320 | individuals linked to previous retail crime and it's now down to staff to act. | 与之前的零售犯罪有关的个人 现在由工作人员来行动 |
| 321 | Emma, you've been | 艾玛,你一直 |
| 322 | if this was real, I would have to ask you to leave. | 如果这是真的 我不得不请你离开 |
| 323 | This was one of Sainsbury's first stores | 这是森斯伯里最早的商店之一 |
| 324 | to get the technology. | 获取技术。 |
| 325 | They say it's needed. | 他们说这是需要的。 |
| 326 | We see a lot of things like verbal abuse. | 我们看到很多像辱骂的东西。 |
| 327 | We see | 我们明白了 |
| 328 | physical abuse. | 身体虐待。 |
| 329 | I mean, for myself, I've had an incident where someone's telling me, you know, | 我的意思是,我自己,我有一个事件 有人告诉我,你知道, |
| 330 | I know where you work and I'm going to, you know, wait for you outside and it can get very scary | 我知道你在哪里工作,我要去,你知道, 等待你在外面,它会变得非常可怕 |
| 331 | at times. | 有时 |
| 332 | She says retail crimes now down. | 她说,零售犯罪 现在下来。 |
| 333 | So far, only 3% of offenders on the watch list | 迄今为止,观察名单上只有3%的罪犯 |
| 334 | have come back. | 已经回来了 |
| 335 | In Oxford, a woman enters trying to cover her face. | 在牛津,一个女人进来试图遮住她的脸. |
| 336 | She doesn't spot the in-store | 她没看到店里的东西 |
| 337 | detective on the left. | 左边是侦探 |
| 338 | They're trained security staff and blend in. | 他们是训练有素的保安人员 并融入其中。 |
| 339 | They travel around targeting | 他们到处走来走去 |
| 340 | stores with the biggest problems. | 拥有最大的问题。 |
| 341 | The shoplifter has been filling her bags with stakes and is | 店主已经给她的包装了木桩 |
| 342 | intercepted on the way out. | 被拦截的路上。 |
| 343 | Kerry, not her real name, has been working as an in-store detective | Kerry不是她的真名 一直在当店里的侦探 |
| 344 | for more than 20 years. | 超过20年 |
| 345 | We're focusing basically on behaviors. | 我们基本上专注于行为。 |
| 346 | Sometimes you're observing someone | 有时候你正在观察某人 |
| 347 | you can almost see like in the head, shall I, shan't I, shall I, shan't I. | 你几乎可以看到像在头部, 我,是不是,我会,是不是我,是不是。 |
| 348 | And then there's, | 还有... |
| 349 | you know, there can be a little look up just to, no one's watching, go on, do it. | 你知道,可以有一个小小的抬头 只是,没有人看,继续,做到这一点。 |
| 350 | How effective is | 多么有效 |
| 351 | it? | 是吗? |
| 352 | This year alone, so since the financial year started, the store detectives have caught 19,000 | 仅今年一年,所以自从财政年度开始, 商店侦探抓住了19,000 |
| 353 | people. | 人们 |
| 354 | In Sainsbury's? | 在森斯伯里家吗? |
| 355 | This is where they gather all the intelligence and evidence presenting it | 他们在这里收集所有的情报和证据 |
| 356 | to police. | 给警察。 |
| 357 | It's led to more than 200 convictions this year. | 导致今年定罪200余人. |
| 358 | A glimpse of the efforts to tackle | A. 概述为克服贫困所作的努力 |
| 359 | retail crime. | 零售犯罪。 |
| 360 | But is this surveillance a step too far? | 但是这种监视是不是太远了? |
| 361 | I appreciate that there's always going to be | 我很感激永远有 |
| 362 | a small group of people or a group of people who find this type of technology challenging. | 一小群人或一群人 认为这种技术具有挑战性。 |
| 363 | But the statistics speak for themselves in terms of its efficiency and effectiveness. | 但是,从统计的效率和成效来看,这些统计数字是站得住脚的。 |
| 364 | And we have to prioritize the vast majority, which for us is the hundreds of thousands of | 我们必须把绝大多数人放在优先位置,这对我们来说是数十万 |
| 365 | customers and our 140,000 colleagues that work in our stores. | 顾客和我们的14万同事 在我们的商店工作。 |
| 366 | I've been in retail for 30 years | 我做零售已经30年了 |
| 367 | and it is the worst we have ever seen it. | 这是我们见过最糟糕的一次 |
| 368 | Sainsbury's is now expanding facial recognition | 森斯伯里现在正在扩大面部识别 |
| 369 | technology to 350 stores by the spring. | 到了春天,有350家商店 |
| 370 | Emma Simpson, BBC News. | 艾玛·辛普森,BBC新闻. |
| 371 | Well, global tech leaders | 全球科技领袖 |
| 372 | are meeting in Lisbon for the annual web summit this week and the growing concerns about the | 本周将在里斯本举行年度网络峰会,人们日益关切 |
| 373 | artificial intelligence industry will focus minds. | 人工智能产业将集中精神. |
| 374 | Also on the agenda, this year's discussions | 同样在议程上,今年的讨论 |
| 375 | promise to move well beyond chatbots and generative AI and into the world of robotics. | 承诺远远超越聊天机和基因AI 进入机器人世界 |
| 376 | Well, let's go | 好吧,我们走吧 |
| 377 | at Cognizant and also co-inventor of the technology that became Apple Siri. | 以及成为苹果Siri的技术的共同发明者 |
| 378 | Welcome | 欢迎光临 |
| 379 | again to the program. | 再来一次 |
| 380 | Thank you, Sally. | 谢谢你,莎莉。 |
| 381 | So what are you hoping for in Lisbon? | 你希望里斯本怎么样? |
| 382 | Well, there's going to be a lot of talk about agents and you know, the web as we know it is | 有很多关于特工的话题 我们所知道的网络 |
| 383 | going to be changing now that agents on behalf of humans are, you know, extracting data and doing | 现在正在改变 代表人类的特工 正在提取数据并采取行动 |
| 384 | stuff on the web. | 网上的东西。 |
| 385 | So I'm personally very excited about announcing this new way of allowing even | 所以我个人非常兴奋 宣布这种新的方式 允许甚至 |
| 386 | pop shops to be able to run their own agents and their own websites and have those agents talk to | 流行商店可以管理自己的代理 和自己的网站 让那些代理说话 |
| 387 | each other. | 彼此间. |
| 388 | So we're launching that along with the hackathon. | 所以,我们要启动 与黑客。 |
| 389 | And, you know, there's information | 还有,你知道,有信息 |
| 390 | 全球代理网站(Worldworld Agenticweb. | |
| 391 | And, you know, | 还有,你知道, |
| 392 | we're doing this with some partners. | 我们跟一些合伙人一起做这个 |
| 393 | It's completely open and in the spirit of the web. | 完全开放,并本着网络精神. |
| 394 | So these are AI assisted agents, aren't they? | 这些是AI的助手,不是吗? |
| 395 | And basically what you're saying is you're | 基本上,你的意思是 你是 |
| 396 | making this available to anyone, any company, no matter how small. | 向任何人,任何公司提供,无论多么小。 |
| 397 | Exactly right. | 没错 |
| 398 | Like the early days of the web, when everyone had a website, we want everyone to | 就像网络的早期, 当每个人都有一个网站, 我们希望每个人都 |
| 399 | be able to represent their selves and their businesses with agents out there. | 能够代表他们自己和他们的企业 在那里的代理人。 |
| 400 | But what are the risks coupled with that? | 但是,还有什么风险呢? |
| 401 | Because when we've heard about agents going rogue, doing | 因为当我们听说特工们叛变时 |
| 402 | things that were not instructed by the likes of OpenAI and ChatGPT having to reveal that these | 诸如OpenAI和ChatGPT等人没有指示的事物,必须披露这些 |
| 403 | things happened in the past, how can you prevent that from happening going forward? | 过去发生的事情,你怎么能阻止这种情况发生呢? |
| 404 | Well, when you get an autonomous agent and give it full command line access, so essentially you | 好吧,当你得到一个自主的代理 并给予它完整的命令线访问, 所以基本上你 |
| 405 | allow it to do anything with your laptop, that's a recipe for disaster. | 允许它做任何事情 用你的笔记本电脑, 这是一个处方灾难。 |
| 406 | And that's something that we | 而这是我们 |
| 407 | really are not advocating for. | 真的没有倡导。 |
| 408 | We're saying we have to engineer it. | 我们说,我们必须 设计它。 |
| 409 | You have to safeguard it. | 你必须保护它。 |
| 410 | It has to be trustworthy. | 它必须是值得信赖的。 |
| 411 | And what it can do is what that business allows it to do. | 它能做的就是它能做的 |
| 412 | And that way, | 那边 |
| 413 | you really, really contain these agents. | 你真的,真的 包含这些特工。 |
| 414 | But how do you prevent people from not | 但你如何阻止人们 |
| 415 | following that advice or that regulation, as it were, and using agents in ways that | 照此建议或条例行事,并以下列方式使用代理人: |
| 416 | are actually detrimental to the company or to others? | 对公司或他人有害? |
| 417 | Yeah. | 对 |
| 418 | So that is your brand. | 这就是你的品牌。 |
| 419 | It is your company. | 这是你的公司。 |
| 420 | If you have an agent on there, you better make | 如果你的经纪人在那里, 你最好做 |
| 421 | sure that it's safe and secure. | 绝对安全 |
| 422 | And of course, there's a lot of ways that we can run guardrails | 当然,有很多方法 我们可以运行护卫 |
| 423 | against these agentic systems. | 对抗这些代理系统。 |
| 424 | And as I said, if we don't allow them, let them loose to do whatever | 正如我所说 如果我们不允许他们做任何事 就让他们松绑 |
| 425 | they want using your computer, we're much, much safer than autonomously allowing them to go out | 他们想用你的电脑 我们比他们能自动出去安全得多 |
| 426 | there and hack into various different companies. | 黑进不同的公司 |
| 427 | So by design, this is secure. | 所以从设计上讲,这是安全的。 |
| 428 | OK. Babak, it's fascinating. | 摆 巴别克,这很迷人 |
| 429 | I wish we had more time to pick your brains, but have a good time | 我希望我们有更多的时间来选择你的大脑, 但有一个好时机 |
| 430 | in Lisbon. | 在里斯本。 (英语). |
| 431 | Thanks for talking to us early this morning. | 谢谢你今早跟我们说话 |
| 432 | Babak,Hodjat那边,把一个关闭 | |
| 433 | business today. | 今天的商务 |
| 434 | Thank you too for your company. | 谢谢你的陪伴 |
| 435 | I'll see you soon. | 后见. |
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