实战练英文 | 美国保守派领袖Charlie Kirk与剑桥
实战练英文 | 美国保守派领袖Charlie Kirk与剑桥师生激辩，学生主席批评川普的外交政策【腐败】；教授支持乌克兰，反对美国的孤立主义；Kirk如何捍卫美
发布于 2025-12-02 · 时长 21:35字幕摘录
| 时间 | 英文 | 中文 |
|---|---|---|
| 0:00 | Thank you. | 谢谢 |
| 0:01 | And the final question that we've got time for today is from Sammy | 而我们今天有时间的最后一个问题是 山米 |
| 0:04 | McDonald from St. John's College. | 圣约翰学院的麦当劳. |
| 0:15 | Good evening Mr. Kirk. | 晚上好,柯克先生,你好吗? |
| 0:16 | You've obviously | 很明显 |
| 0:17 | devoted a lot of your life to electing, keeping in power Donald Trump and you | 你毕生致力于选举 保持唐纳德·特朗普和你的权力 |
| 0:21 | did so partly because you said Trump would put Americans first and take them | 部分是因为你说特朗普会把美国人放在第一位 然后带走他们 |
| 0:24 | out of foreign conflicts. | 远离外国冲突。 |
| 0:25 | Should we see how that is going at the moment? | 我们该看看现在情况如何吗? |
| 0:29 | Currently Trump has just accepted a 400 million dollar debt from Qatar which | 目前特朗普刚刚接受了卡塔尔4亿美元的债务, |
展开字幕全文（380 条）
| 序号 | 英文 | 中文 |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | Thank you. | 谢谢 |
| 2 | And the final question that we've got time for today is from Sammy | 而我们今天有时间的最后一个问题是 山米 |
| 3 | McDonald from St. John's College. | 圣约翰学院的麦当劳. |
| 4 | Good evening Mr. Kirk. | 晚上好,柯克先生,你好吗? |
| 5 | You've obviously | 很明显 |
| 6 | devoted a lot of your life to electing, keeping in power Donald Trump and you | 你毕生致力于选举 保持唐纳德·特朗普和你的权力 |
| 7 | did so partly because you said Trump would put Americans first and take them | 部分是因为你说特朗普会把美国人放在第一位 然后带走他们 |
| 8 | out of foreign conflicts. | 远离外国冲突。 |
| 9 | Should we see how that is going at the moment? | 我们该看看现在情况如何吗? |
| 10 | Currently Trump has just accepted a 400 million dollar debt from Qatar which | 目前特朗普刚刚接受了卡塔尔4亿美元的债务, |
| 11 | we're assured is perfectly above board. | 我们保证是完全高于板。 |
| 12 | Billions in arms are going to Saudi | 数十亿的军火要运往沙特 |
| 13 | Arabia which they're using to bomb and starve Yemeni children. | 他们用来轰炸和饿死也门儿童的阿拉伯。 |
| 14 | Not sure how | 不知道怎样 |
| 15 | that's in the interest of the United States but it might be in the interest of | 这符合美国的利益,但可能有利于 |
| 16 | the five and a half billion dollar deal his failed sons are receiving. | 他失败的儿子们正在接受的 价值55亿美元的交易 |
| 17 | At the | 在那个 |
| 18 | same time this great president of peace has greenlit mass killings not just in | 同时这位伟大的和平总统 不仅在 |
| 19 | Yemen but in Gaza where he greenlit an invasion called Operation Gideon's | 也门,但在加沙,他绿化了一场入侵, 称为吉迪恩行动 |
| 20 | Chariot with the express aim of wiping out the Gaza population. | 以消灭加沙居民为明确目标的战车。 |
| 21 | You promised to | 你答应过的 |
| 22 | put America first. | 把美国放在首位。 |
| 23 | Haven't you and your ilk sold America out? | 你和你那帮家伙没卖掉美国吗? |
| 24 | Well I'm glad you | 我很高兴你 |
| 25 | have great intellectual substance and can answer. | 拥有伟大的知识实质,并能回答. |
| 26 | Because it's all the culture was for you isn't it? | 因为这是所有的文化 为你,不是吗? |
| 27 | The second someone actually tells you what you're doing would you just... Can you | 第二个人告诉你你在做什么 你会... 你能吗? |
| 28 | calm down a little bit like a little bit? | 冷静一点,像一点点? |
| 29 | Pound on the table you're all over the | 在桌子上打一顿 你全身都是 |
| 30 | place. | 地点。 |
| 31 | No you want me to go piece by piece or would you like me to talk | 不,你想让我一个个地走 还是要我说话? |
| 32 | slower? | 慢点? |
| 33 | I think you can... | 我觉得你可以... |
| 34 | Number one, Donald Trump is convening a peace deal | 第一,唐纳德·特朗普正在召开和约 |
| 35 | between Russia and Ukraine. | 俄罗斯和乌克兰之间。 |
| 36 | Joe Biden gave them... That's going well isn't it? | 乔·拜登给他们的... 进展顺利吧? |
| 37 | Can you not | 不可以吗? |
| 38 | interrupt me? | 打断我? |
| 39 | I allowed you to talk uninterrupted. | 我让你畅所欲言 |
| 40 | You're famous for not | 你以没有出名 |
| 41 | interrupting. | 打断一下 |
| 42 | I haven't interrupted a single person here today. | 我今天没打断任何人 |
| 43 | Can I can I | 我可以吗? |
| 44 | speak uninterrupted actually? | 说话不中断吗? |
| 45 | He is convening a peace deal between Russia | 他正在俄国之间达成和约 |
| 46 | Ukraine. | 乌克兰。 |
| 47 | I believe we will see an end to that war. | 我相信我们将看到战争的结束。 |
| 48 | Number two, he's actually | 第二,他其实是 |
| 49 | talking to Iran and discouraging Israel to strike the interior of Iran and has | 与伊朗对话并劝阻以色列袭击伊朗内地 |
| 50 | stopped many other international countries to do the same. | 阻止了许多其他国际国家也这样做。 |
| 51 | Number three, | 三号 |
| 52 | can you give him credit for ending the Indian-Pakistan war? | 你能对他结束印巴战争表示赞扬吗? |
| 53 | Both of them said he | 他们都说他 |
| 54 | didn't do that. | 不是那样的 |
| 55 | Well hold on a second. | 等一等 等一等 |
| 56 | Let's let's go back. | 师便回. |
| 57 | No no no that's... Russia-Ukraine. | 不,不,不,这是... |
| 58 | That's important. | 这很重要 |
| 59 | Can I speak now? | 我能说话了吗? |
| 60 | Yes but the Indian-Pakistan thing you've | 是的,但印度 -巴基斯坦的事情你已经 |
| 61 | got to go deeper than that. | 得更深入一点 |
| 62 | Let's go with let's go in order. | 随顺而去. |
| 63 | Is a peace | 这是和平 |
| 64 | summit where the main person in question Russia doesn't show up, is that a | 顶峰 问题的主要人物 俄罗斯不出现,是 |
| 65 | success Mr. Kirk? | 成功吗,柯克先生? |
| 66 | I'm not even sure. | 我什至不确定。 |
| 67 | Well again these are ongoing | 再说一遍,这些还在继续 |
| 68 | negotiations and it's a lot better than when your Prime Minister Boris Johnson | 比起你的首相鲍里斯·约翰逊 谈判和谈判 好多了 |
| 69 | went alongside our Secretary of State Tony Blinken to Istanbul and | 和我们的国务卿托尼·布林肯一起去了伊斯坦布尔 |
| 70 | unnecessarily blew up a potential Russian peace deal which has resulted in | 毫无必要地炸毁了潜在的俄罗斯和约,导致 |
| 71 | hundreds of thousands of dead Ukrainians, one of the great unnecessary wars of the | 数十万乌克兰人死亡,是乌克兰的一场大不必要的战争。 |
| 72 | modern era. | 现代。 |
| 73 | Donald Trump believes in conversation and police boot through | 唐纳德·特朗普相信对话 相信警察通过 |
| 74 | strength. | 强。 |
| 75 | He has been president for well over 120 to 130 days and he has already | 他已经当了120到130天的总统了 |
| 76 | ended a war between two nuclear conflicts of India-Pakistan. | 结束了印度-巴基斯坦两个核冲突之间的战争。 |
| 77 | He has | 他已经 |
| 78 | secured our own US southern border while we were being invaded by foreign powers. | 我们被外国势力入侵时 已经封锁了美国南部边境 |
| 79 | And thirdly he is brokering a potential settlement with Iran that will prevent | 第三,他正在与伊朗达成可能的解决办法,防止 |
| 80 | a major escalation in the Middle East and finally it is very difficult but I | 中东的大规模升级 最终非常困难 但我 |
| 81 | believe they'll get it done that will finally see an end to the Russian-Ukrainian | 相信他们会完成的 最终会结束俄乌战争 |
| 82 | war. | 战争。 |
| 83 | I'm just going to disregard the enormous lies you just put out there | 我只是要无视你刚才说的谎言 |
| 84 | about Russia and Ukraine but do you really think leverage negotiations work | 关于俄罗斯和乌克兰,但你真的认为杠杆谈判有用吗? |
| 85 | if you cut off all your leverage and scream at one party in the Oval Office? | 如果你切断了你所有的筹码 并尖叫一个派对 在椭圆形办公室? |
| 86 | Don't you think that has just emboldened Russia? | 你不觉得这让俄国胆大妄为吗? |
| 87 | Because look at the approach. | 因为看这个方法 |
| 88 | Putin thinks so much of your glorious president he can't even be asked to | 普京认为你光荣的总统 他甚至不能被要求 |
| 89 | show up. | 出现. |
| 90 | You have elected or help elect somebody who is at best an idiot and at | 你选出或帮助选出一个 充其量是白痴的人 |
| 91 | worst is deeply corrupt. | 最糟糕的是腐败 |
| 92 | Okay again so Trump and Putin had a two-hour phone | 好吧,再次,所以特朗普和普京有一个两个小时的电话。 |
| 93 | call today you'll acknowledge that's a good thing. | 今天打电话给你,你会承认 这是好事。 |
| 94 | The pursuit of peace can | 追求和平可以 |
| 95 | sometimes be a winding road and it's a lot better than sending hundreds of | 有时是一条顺风的路, 这比发送数百个更好 |
| 96 | billions in dollars further into the killing fields of eastern Ukraine | 数十亿美元进入乌克兰东部的杀戮地 |
| 97 | something that tragically both the UK government and the US government has been | 英国政府和美国政府都曾是 |
| 98 | unnecessarily supporting for a couple of years. | 不必要地支持了几年。 |
| 99 | President Trump wants to see a | 川普总统想看看 |
| 100 | brokerage and ending of this settlement I pray we can get it. | 做经纪和结束这个和解,我祈祷我们能得到它。 |
| 101 | It's very | 这是非常 |
| 102 | complicated because the mess that Joe Biden left which was an active kinetic | 因为乔·拜登留下的烂摊子 是主动动力 |
| 103 | war with a nuclear power sending American-made missiles into the | 美国制造的导弹进入美国 |
| 104 | interior of Russia. | 俄罗斯内地. |
| 105 | So President Trump has already ended a war he's ended an | 所以川普总统结束了一场战争 他结束了一场战争 |
| 106 | invasion he's only 130 days into this and I believe we do not know at this | 入侵他只有130天时间 我相信我们不知道 |
| 107 | point we are merely speculating which I think we should not spend our time doing | 我们只是猜测 我认为我们不应该花时间做 |
| 108 | that because eventually one of us will be right. | 因为最终我们中的一个是对的 |
| 109 | I believe we will be right and I | 我相信我们会是正确的,我 |
| 110 | believe we'll see an end to this war. | 相信这场战争将会结束 |
| 111 | Can we just talk about a hundred billions | 我们能谈谈一千亿吗? |
| 112 | worth of weapons because you dodged my question on what was going on in the | 武器的价值,因为你躲开了我的问题 关于发生了什么事在 |
| 113 | Middle East where Trump has just signed enormous arms contracts with Saudi | 在中东,特朗普刚刚与沙特签署了巨大的军火合同 |
| 114 | Arabia and with Qatar and you I noticed you ignored the fact that this might | 阿拉伯和卡塔尔,还有你 我注意到你忽略了这个事实 |
| 115 | have had anything to do with the blatant corruption going on through the Trump | 与特朗普的公然腐败有关 |
| 116 | coin and going on through giving the very competent sons of Donald Trump | 让唐纳德·特朗普的儿子们 |
| 117 | billions of investment from Saudi Arabia and Qatar. | 沙特阿拉伯和卡塔尔投资数十亿。 |
| 118 | This is something that is | 这是一件 |
| 119 | directly embroiling Americans into conflict but is importantly killing many | 直接使美国人陷入冲突 但重要的是要杀死很多人 |
| 120 | innocent people. | 无辜的人。 |
| 121 | Those nations have been known to terrorize innocent civilian | 众所周知,这些国家恐吓无辜平民。 |
| 122 | populations. | 人口数量。 |
| 123 | So if you if you're coming to me and you're objecting to America | 所以如果你来找我,你反对美国 |
| 124 | selling weaponry why are you defending shilling for the Saudis? | 为什么你们要为沙特人保卫先令? |
| 125 | Well hold on one | 好吧,坚持一个 |
| 126 | is sending weaponry one is purchasing secondly you do know that the biggest | 送武器是买的 第二,你知道最大的 |
| 127 | purchase that was announced was commercial airliner 737 a hundred | 已宣布为737-100商用客机 |
| 128 | billion dollars we've heard of Qatar Airways they purchase a hundred billion | 我们听说卡塔尔航空公司 购买了1000亿美元 |
| 129 | dollars of commercial airways you are right there were some weapons contracts | 商业航道的美元 你说得对 有一些武器合同 |
| 130 | but I guess the question is would you rather have Saudi Arabia buy weapons from | 但我想问题是 你是否愿意让沙特阿拉伯从 |
| 131 | America or China? | 美国还是中国? |
| 132 | I'd rather they not have American weaponry at cut price rates. | 我宁愿他们没有美国武器 以削减的价格。 |
| 133 | I disagree. | 我不同意这个观点。 |
| 134 | Let's talk about Qatar for a second. | 我们谈谈卡塔尔吧 |
| 135 | Okay fine. | 好吧,没事。 |
| 136 | You mentioned Qatar. | 你提到卡塔尔。 |
| 137 | You've been talking a lot about Hamas and the evils of Hamas. | 你一直在谈论哈马斯和哈马斯的邪恶。 |
| 138 | Can I ask you who's the main funder of Hamas? | 我能问你谁是哈马斯的主要资助者吗? |
| 139 | Well the palest state. | 最好的状态。 |
| 140 | Well the | 那个 |
| 141 | West actually funds Hamas. | 西方实际上资助哈马斯。 |
| 142 | Which state? | 哪个州? |
| 143 | Well Iran funds. | 好吧,伊朗的资金。 |
| 144 | No no no where are the Hamas | 不 不 没有哈马斯在哪里 |
| 145 | leaders? | 头儿? |
| 146 | And also Qatar funds Hamas. | 卡塔尔也资助哈马斯. |
| 147 | It is a it is a combination. | 它是一个组合。 |
| 148 | Is this a state we should have a four hundred million jet with the | 我们是不是应该有四亿架喷气式飞机 |
| 149 | United States on it? | 美国呢? |
| 150 | Hold on first of all it was not given to him personally I | 坚持住,首先,它不是给他个人的 |
| 151 | understand the optics optics of it but it was not given to him personally it was | 了解它的光学 但它不是亲自给他的 |
| 152 | given to the US government and under that standard no US government should | 给予美国政府,根据该标准,美国政府不应 |
| 153 | ever receive any gifts from any foreign operative countries whatsoever it's not | 任何外国活动国提供的礼物 不论不是 |
| 154 | given to him personally and not a violation of it. | 给他个人而不是违反 |
| 155 | Why is he trying to | 为什么他要 |
| 156 | transfer it to his personal he's library? | 转到他个人的图书馆? |
| 157 | He is actually. | 他其实是。 |
| 158 | Okay he sent out this | 好吧,他发了这个 |
| 159 | is way too in the weeds we want to keep on going it we can. | 也是我们想继续的杂草里 |
| 160 | It's not in the weeds it's a | 不在草丛里,它是一个 |
| 161 | fundamental moral principle. | 基本道德原则。 |
| 162 | Okay so under that fundamental moral | 好吧,根据这个基本道德 |
| 163 | principle then can you acknowledge though that President Trump is getting | 那你可以承认 川普总统正在接受 |
| 164 | more done in a less period of time than any president we've seen while our prior | 比我们之前见过的总统 在更短的时间内做得更多 |
| 165 | president was not did not even know what year he got elected. | 总统甚至不知道他当选的年份。 |
| 166 | You understand the | 你明白吗 |
| 167 | contrast here? | 这里的对比? |
| 168 | What about him again? | 他又怎样了? |
| 169 | I'm not a defender of Biden. | 我不是拜登的卫士 |
| 170 | No I'm not saying | 不,我不是说 |
| 171 | President Trump is far better than the predecessor. | 川普总统远胜于前任. |
| 172 | You're going to have to defend the person you spent millions to elect. | 你得为你花上百万选举的人辩护 |
| 173 | I will I will defend every day of someone who ends an invasion that's all | 我每天都会为结束入侵的人辩护 |
| 174 | you do is brings down the price of oil who is revitalizing the American economy | 你这样做是降低石油的价格 谁正在振兴美国经济 |
| 175 | who's brokering peace who stopped the potential nuclear war who is bringing | 他正在促成和平 阻止潜在的核战争 |
| 176 | Iran to the table and bringing Russia to the table someone who does not want | 伊朗坐到桌子上 让俄罗斯坐到桌子上 |
| 177 | armed conflicts with the greatest powers of our time I will defend that endlessly | 我将无休止地捍卫 |
| 178 | What are you defending? | 你在为什么辩护? |
| 179 | You are living in a fantasy world of your own creation so it's quite | 你生活在你自己创造的幻想世界里 所以这是相当的 |
| 180 | hard to engage with. | 很难接触。 |
| 181 | You can say that but then disprove it. | 你可以这么说,但可以反驳 |
| 182 | Let's check on how Trump is doing in | 看看特朗普现在怎么样 |
| 183 | terms of diplomacy. | 外交条件。 |
| 184 | Look with the war in the Middle East do you think it was a | 看看中东的战争 你觉得这是一场 |
| 185 | agree for Israel to invade the Gaza Strip and to continue to murder thousands | 同意以色列入侵加沙地带并继续谋杀数千人 |
| 186 | of innocent children and civilians in a pointless war is that in America's | 在毫无意义的战争中无辜儿童和平民遭受的伤害,是在美国 |
| 187 | interest is that in humanity well first of all you should know so much Trump | 关心的是,在人类中,首先你应该知道 川普这么多 |
| 188 | there's something he's realized with Trump over the last 10 years he is quite | 他和特朗普在过去10年中 已经意识到了一些事情 |
| 189 | the social media user and uses hyperbolic language at times but let me | 社交媒体用户有时使用双曲语言,但让我 |
| 190 | ask you in the conflict of Israel versus Hamas who's the good guy believe both | 在以色列和哈马斯的冲突中 问你们谁是好人 |
| 191 | Hamas and the Israeli government are evil but I think also there is no | 哈马斯和以色列政府是邪恶的 但我也认为没有 |
| 192 | justification for the murder and mutilation of thousands of innocent | 杀害和残害数千名无辜者 |
| 193 | people and children invading hospitals bombing innocent populations and dragging | 人民和儿童入侵医院 轰炸无辜民众和拖拉 |
| 194 | out a war which is damaging Israel and the West you've made that point but it's | 这场战争正在破坏以色列和西方... ... |
| 195 | not a point it's a moral truth isn't it yeah it was also moral truth that the | 一点也不是道德的真理 也不是道德的真理 |
| 196 | war started because 1,300 Jews were killed and 200 were taken hostage you | 战争开始了 因为有1300名犹太人被杀 200名被劫持为人质 |
| 197 | when you declare war in Israel expect a firestorm in reaction let me finish I | 当你在以色列宣战时... ...会遇到大火... ...让我说完 |
| 198 | let you talk Israel had its holiest day of the calendar year besides Yom Kippur | 除了赎罪日以外,你还有这个历年最神圣的一天 |
| 199 | and Rosh Hashanah the 50 year anniversary of the six-day war on | 和罗什・哈沙纳 6天战争50周年 |
| 200 | Shabbat Hamas invaded Israel deciding to go recklessly to music concert concerts | 哈马斯沙巴特入侵以色列,决定鲁莽地去参加音乐会 |
| 201 | to homes to kibbutz's and taking 200 plus hostages they knew what they were | 他们知道自己是什么样的人 |
| 202 | doing in one of the most cloistered urban environments on the planet two | 在地球上最密不可分的城市环境之一 |
| 203 | million people live in a place where it's impossible to wage war impossible | 百万人生活在一个不可能发动战争的地方 |
| 204 | where they wear civilian clothing they violate every tenant the Geneva | 他们穿着便衣 侵犯日内瓦的每个租户 |
| 205 | Convention and the IDF when they do something right they get no credit when | 《公约》和以色列国防军当他们做正确的事时,就得不到信贷。 |
| 206 | they do life-saving surgeries of a Gazan child they get no credit when they drive | 他们为加沙儿童做救生手术 开车时得不到任何信贷 |
| 207 | leaflets drop leaflets they get no credit but when they happen to bomb a | 传单投放传单,没有功劳,但碰巧爆炸 |
| 208 | place where they are operating their military from which we now know from | 在那里,他们正在运行 他们的军事,我们现在知道从 |
| 209 | third-party verified sources hundreds of Hamas military operations are in mosques | 哈马斯数百次军事行动发生在清真寺 |
| 210 | schools and hospitals I'm sorry the country that where they were living in | 学校和医院,我很抱歉 这个国家,他们住 |
| 211 | relative peace on October 6 but all of a sudden we had a war and Hamas started the | 10月6日相对和平,但突然我们开战,哈马斯发动了这场战争。 |
| 212 | {\fn华文楷体\fs20\bord1\shad1\1cHE0E0E0\2cH000000}我沒看到有人為這兩百萬而生氣 {\fn华文楷体\fs20\bord1\shad1\1cHE0E0E0\2cH000000} | |
| 213 | Germans that were killed in World War two civilians a tragic truth of war is | 德国人在世界大战中阵亡的两名平民 一个悲惨的战争真相是 |
| 214 | that civilians die I don't like it and you don't like it and they brought it | 平民死了 我不喜欢 你不喜欢 他们带来了 |
| 215 | upon themselves the only operation and empty to the blame is the leadership of | 唯一的行动 和空虚的责任是领导 |
| 216 | Hamas not the Israeli government for fighting this defensive war after they | 哈马斯不是以色列政府在他们发动这场防御战争之后 |
| 217 | were invaded we defend the terrible pogrom that was launched against Jews on | 我们为针对犹太人的恐怖大屠杀辩护 |
| 218 | that day but the justification for the death of innocents cannot be an | 但无辜者死亡的理由不能是 |
| 219 | infinite cycle of bloodlust it cannot be killing tens of thousands of innocent | 血流成河不可能杀死成千上万无辜的人 |
| 220 | civilians with a war with no end in sight people who were not complicit in | 战争无止境的平民, |
| 221 | those atrocities it cannot be bombing hospitals which children use it cannot | 这些暴行不能是轰炸医院 儿童不能使用 |
| 222 | be bombing hospitals in which cancer patients are dying and starving in there | 炸医院 里面的癌症病人正在死亡和挨饿 |
| 223 | the deaths that have been inflicted nobody knows the true toll but somewhere | 除了某处 没人知道真正的死亡人数 |
| 224 | between 50 and 100 thousand people lie dead under the rubble and what is left | 5万到10万人死在废墟下 剩下什么 |
| 225 | for Gaza except for to continue to suffer under Hamas because it turns out | 除了在哈马斯统治下继续受苦之外, |
| 226 | Netanyahu's political strategy has not worked it has entrenched Hamas within | 内塔尼亚胡的政治战略没有奏效,它把哈马斯扎根于 |
| 227 | the territories to be a Christian I would have thought mr. Kirk would never | 我本以为是基督徒的领地 柯克永远不会 |
| 228 | have involved suggesting that the price for an atrocity must be an infinite | 意味着暴行的代价必须是无限的 |
| 229 | cycle of bloodlust that innocent people and the young population must be killed | 流血循环,无辜者和年轻人必须被杀害 |
| 230 | to avenge some kind of providential question how can you call yourself a Christian? | 为某种天生问题报仇 你怎么能自称基督徒? |
| 231 | I want to make sure we get our moral clarity straight before we proceed | 我想在继续前确保我们的道德清晰度 |
| 232 | no one likes what's happening in Gaza no one with a heart or a soul or a mind | 没有人喜欢加沙发生的事情 没有一个人有心有灵 |
| 233 | likes when kids die but you must understand who started the conflict so | 喜欢孩子死的时候 但你必须明白谁挑起了冲突 |
| 234 | you could end it correctly and until Hamas brokers an unconditional surrender | 你可以正确地结束这一切 直到哈马斯无条件投降 |
| 235 | of which they are unwilling to do they could release the hostages and drop | 他们不愿意这样做 他们可以释放人质 并放下 |
| 236 | their weapons and their lives would be spared instead they are using children | 他们的武器和生命将会幸免 而不是他们利用儿童 |
| 237 | of Gaza as cannon fodder financed by the Iranian mullahs and dragging the entire | 伊朗毛拉资助的大炮饲料, |
| 238 | world into this this conflict so I don't even know what we're debating at this | 这个世界陷入了这场冲突 所以我甚至不知道我们到底在辩论什么 |
| 239 | point other than I believe that Israel and I believe the facts Israel was | 我认为以色列和我认为以色列是 |
| 240 | unconditionally attacked on October 7th they're responding in kind and I would | 10月7日被无条件攻击,他们以实物回应,我会 |
| 241 | just ask you a very simple moral question how should Israel have responded? | 只是问你一个非常简单的道德问题,以色列应该如何回答? |
| 242 | Not with the blanket carpet bombing the city not with bombing hospitals of | 不与毯子爆炸 城市与轰炸医院 |
| 243 | some kind of military operation might have been necessary but not murder on | 某种军事行动可能是必要的,但不是谋杀 |
| 244 | this scale there is no justification for what is happening with the enormous | 这种规模是没有道理的 |
| 245 | death toll that is being produced I really cannot see how you come here and | 死亡的死亡人数正在产生 我真的不知道你怎么来到这里 |
| 246 | you have the gall to lecture us on Christian morality and then sit here and | 你有勇气教我们基督教道德 然后坐在这里 |
| 247 | justify the murder of thousands of civilians is it working? | 为杀害数千名平民辩护吗? |
| 248 | It's Hamas dismantled. | 是哈马斯拆除的 |
| 249 | I've never said that. | 我从没说过 |
| 250 | You just did. | 你刚刚做了。 |
| 251 | In war these are called casualties of a war again I'm not ever I'm not gonna | 在战争中,这些被称为 战争的伤亡再次,我永远不会,我不会 |
| 252 | justify every military maneuver of a hundred thousand person army instead | 为十万人的军队的每一次军事行动辩护 |
| 253 | what I will do is I'll be clear that there is a good guy and there is a bad | 我会明白,有一个好人和一个坏人 |
| 254 | guy I'm I honestly not the morality of a child well it's interesting you say that | 小子,我真的不是孩子的道德,你这么说很有趣 |
| 255 | because a child who knows that Israel is the good guy Hamas is bad has a lot more | 因为一个知道以色列是好人... 哈马斯是坏人... |
| 256 | wisdom than a student like yourself at Cambridge University I will be glad I | 在剑桥大学比像你这样的学生聪明 我会很高兴的 |
| 257 | will not have been somebody who has defended the genocide of the | 也不会是曾为种族灭绝辩护的人 |
| 258 | Palestinian people and I think you will have to reckon one day that you have | 巴勒斯坦人民和我认为你总有一天会想到 |
| 259 | reckoned interesting I want to close on this so can you can you tell me what | 很有趣 我想结束这件事 你能告诉我什么 |
| 260 | African countries currently and ongoing a civil war believe it or not I know | 非洲国家现在和正在进行的内战,无论是否相信,我知道 |
| 261 | about Sudan okay good idiot who's the how about the what | 关于苏丹 好吧,谁是好白痴 谁是什么 |
| 262 | southeastern Asian country has an ethnic cleansing going on right now good and | 东南亚国家正在进行种族清洗, |
| 263 | you have strong opinions on both sides | 你对双方都有强烈的看法 |
| 264 | you are a culture warrior I believe when everything is done mr. Kirk people will | 你是一个文化战士,我相信当一切都完成了,先生。 柯克人会的 |
| 265 | see you and the people you supported as corrupt as selling the country out to | 看见你和那些你支持的人 就如同出卖国家一样腐败 |
| 266 | the lowest bidder and of doing irreparable damage to a country I'm sure | 最低的出价 以及对一个国家造成无法弥补的损害 我敢肯定 |
| 267 | we all deep down love the difference you will have to reckon with that | 我们深爱的区别 你将不得不考虑 |
| 268 | difference is when the difference is when we get our way we'll still have a | 不同的是,当不同的是 当我们得到我们的方式,我们仍将有一个 |
| 269 | country and your country will be a third-world hellhole next question we've | 这个国家和你们的国家将是一个第三世界地狱洞 我们的下一个问题 |
| 270 | got time for today and mr. Kirk has another engagement so we're going to | 今天有时间了 先生 柯克又订婚了 所以我们要去 |
| 271 | walk out of the chamber no I think this is all we've got time for today you guys | 不,我想今天我们只有这个时间了 |
| 272 | are easy it will take a couple more does anyone have any questions who's the best | 很简单,要多花一对夫妇 有人问谁是最好的 |
| 273 | thank you a very very short question Israel versus Hamas good guy versus bad | 一个非常简短的问题,以色列与哈马斯 好人与坏人 |
| 274 | guy Russia versus Ukraine who's the good guy and who's the bad guy both are bad | 俄罗斯对乌克兰的好人和坏人都是坏人 |
| 275 | one is worse which way round Russia is worse than Ukraine okay so why haven't | 更糟糕的是哪条路比乌克兰更糟糕 |
| 276 | we pursued that what do you mean well it seems to me that in the whole of the | 我们追求的,你是什么意思好 在我看来,在整个 |
| 277 | current US proposition that Ukraine is being the bad guy in what way we funded | 目前美国认为乌克兰是坏人 我们如何资助 |
| 278 | Ukraine upwards to two hundred billion dollars absolutely but I just signed a | 乌克兰绝对高达两千亿美元 但我刚刚签了个协议 |
| 279 | mineral deal with Ukraine not Russia yeah but you are expecting Ukraine to | 对,但你期望乌克兰 |
| 280 | give up 20% of its territory someone who invaded it well is Crimea part of Russia | 放弃20%的领土 入侵它的人是俄罗斯的克里米亚的一部分 |
| 281 | or Ukraine Ukraine that's where we don't agree well I'm afraid that's part of | 或乌克兰 在那里,我们不同意 恐怕这是的一部分 |
| 282 | national treaty that's not up for grabs even Zelensky has said he's willing to | 连泽连斯基都说他愿意 |
| 283 | give up Ukraine no America signed the agreement that gave Ukraine Crimea right | 没有美国签署赋予乌克兰克里米亚权利的协议 |
| 284 | and the Soviet Union ended right it was it was done and we never first of all | 苏联结束了正确的 它已经做到了 我们从来没有首先 |
| 285 | never should have been done it was largely ceremony but however it was | 本来不该这么做的 基本上只是仪式而已 |
| 286 | annexed under Obama yes and it was a mistake and it should be given back to | 在奥巴马的统治下 是的 这是个错误 应该还给 |
| 287 | Russia as a sign of good gesture to end this conflict who's currently controlling | 作为结束这场冲突的良好姿态,俄罗斯正在控制 |
| 288 | Crimea where was the Russian Navy headquartered in World War two where | 克里米亚是俄罗斯海军的总部 在第二次世界大战中在哪里? |
| 289 | was the the end of World War two son this is very daunting that I'm not | 那时是世界大战结束的时候 两个儿子... ... |
| 290 | doubting that I'm just saying that if we're being logical on what has | 怀疑我只是说 如果我们在什么问题上合乎逻辑 |
| 291 | happened that you are now arguing against that flow and I don't understand | 发生的事情,你现在正在争论 与流,我不明白 |
| 292 | it because actually why is Ukraine the bad guy no I said they're bad they're | 因为为什么乌克兰是坏人 我说他们是坏的 |
| 293 | the bad guy yeah well you said they were both bad but one was more bad yes so why | 坏人 你说他们都是坏人 但有一个更坏 |
| 294 | is Ukraine bad there's a lot wrong with Ukraine first of all they're not a | 乌克兰不好,乌克兰有很多问题 首先,他们不是 |
| 295 | democracy so Lensky refuses to hold an election well no he can't hold an | 所以Lensky拒绝举行选举... ...他不能举行... |
| 296 | election oh wait did Churchill hold an election during the war because under | 丘吉尔在战争期间举行选举是因为 |
| 297 | his constitution on Lincoln held election during the war he could that's | 他关于林肯的宪法 在战争期间举行了选举 他可以 |
| 298 | not true he can call an election you call a snap election he's full dictator | 不是真的,他可以称之为选举 你称之为快速选举 他完全的独裁者 |
| 299 | of the country no he knows that the people of Ukraine would kick him out | 他不知道乌克兰人民会把他赶出去 |
| 300 | immediately because he's deeply unpopular in fact if he wanted to show | 因为它非常不受欢迎 事实上,如果他想要显示 |
| 301 | a statement to the world he would call an election and win by 80% and say see | 向世界发表声明,他会召集选举 并赢得80%,说看 |
| 302 | I'm super popular so that's number one I have a problem with that I have a | 我超受欢迎,所以我有一个问题 |
| 303 | problem with a person being propped up as a government we're sending two | 一个人被立为政府的问题 我们要派两个 |
| 304 | hundred billion dollars to that refuses even to face his voters okay I can't | 一千亿美元,甚至拒绝 面对他的选民。 |
| 305 | agree with you factually on that at all okay I mean constitutionally Ukraine is | 事实上,我同意你的观点 宪法上乌克兰是 |
| 306 | not able to hold an election because it's under the true law at the moment | 无法举行选举,因为它是 真正的法律现在 |
| 307 | And that's just a matter of fact. | 且道是实事. |
| 308 | Again, he can, as a prime minister or president, he can do whatever he wants. | 同样,作为总理或总统,他可以做任何他想做的事。 |
| 309 | He can't. | 他不会的 |
| 310 | He can't sign an executive order and change their constitution. | 他不能签署行政命令,改变他们的宪法. |
| 311 | Neither can the American president either. | 美国总统也一样 |
| 312 | He could even do a ceremonial election to see | 他甚至可以做一个仪式选举 看 |
| 313 | where he actually stands with the people. | 在那里他实际上站在人民。 |
| 314 | I think we call those opinion polls. | 我认为我们称之为民意调查。 |
| 315 | Yes and they're very negative. | 是的,他们非常消极。 |
| 316 | Firmly ahead in the opinion polls. | 在民意测验中,有坚定的领先地位。 |
| 317 | Again, but you would agree that a person that holds on to power | 再说一遍,但你同意一个掌权的人 |
| 318 | without the election of the sovereign is pretty questionable. | 没有君主的选举,是相当可疑的。 |
| 319 | No, not in those circumstances. | 不,不是在这种情况下。 |
| 320 | Okay, then we disagree. | 好吧,那么我们不同意。 |
| 321 | No, okay, that's fine. | 不,没关系。 |
| 322 | But give me another reason why you... | 但是给我另一个原因 为什么你... |
| 323 | They are the most corrupt country in Europe | 他们是欧洲最腐败的国家 |
| 324 | that never even met the most remote standards of joining NATO. | 甚至从未达到加入北约的最远标准。 |
| 325 | I do not know where a lot of this money is going. | 我不知道这些钱会去哪 |
| 326 | I don't disagree that there is a problem with corruption | 我不同意腐败的问题 |
| 327 | but the most corrupt country in Europe, are you sure about that? | 但欧洲最腐败的国家 你确定吗? |
| 328 | I'd have to think, I'd have to double or triple think about that but they're very corrupt. | 我不得不想,我不得不双倍或三倍的思考 但他们非常腐败。 |
| 329 | Okay, so that's a little bit doubtful, it's not absolute. | 好吧,这有点可疑,不是绝对的。 |
| 330 | I mean, there's plenty of corruption around. | 我的意思是,周围有很多腐败。 |
| 331 | I mean, let's face it, we are talking about comparison | 我的意思是,让我们面对它, 我们正在谈论比较 |
| 332 | with some of the states you're doing business with in the Gulf. | 你和海湾的一些州做生意 |
| 333 | Of course, but we're not giving them money, they're giving us money. | 当然 但我们不给他们钱 他们给我们钱 |
| 334 | That's the difference, right? | 这就是区别,对不对? |
| 335 | Saudi Arabia is... | 沙特阿拉伯是... |
| 336 | Oh, so it's fine. | 哦,所以这是罚款。 |
| 337 | Well, hold on a second. | 好吧,等一下,请等一下。 |
| 338 | It's morally acceptable to take money from corruption. | 从腐败中取钱在道德上是可以接受的. |
| 339 | Well, hold on. | 好吧,坚持住。 |
| 340 | First of all, as far as morally acceptable, | 首先,就道德上可接受的而言, |
| 341 | you do what's best in the benefit of your country. | 你为国家做最好的事 |
| 342 | And so, for example, we were allied with Russia during the Second World War | 例如,第二次世界大战期间 我们和俄国结盟 |
| 343 | and I'm glad we were. | 我很高兴我们是。 |
| 344 | And I would ask you, how much money is too much money to send to Ukraine? | 我想问你, 多少钱是太多的钱 寄给乌克兰? |
| 345 | We're at 200 billion right now. | 我们现在有两千亿 |
| 346 | I don't think you have to send any more money to Ukraine. | 我想你不必再给乌克兰寄钱了 |
| 347 | We agree. | 我们同意。 |
| 348 | I think you have to agree to support them as a free country | 我认为你必须同意支持他们作为一个自由国家 |
| 349 | and perhaps sell them weapons. | 并可能出售武器。 |
| 350 | You're very happy to sell weapons to less free countries. | 你很高兴能把武器卖给自由程度较低的国家 |
| 351 | And I think Europe will pick up the slack as we ought to. | 我想欧洲会像我们所该做的一样放松 |
| 352 | And I don't disagree with some of the comments about Europe not looking after its own security. | 我并不反对一些关于欧洲不关心自身安全的评论。 |
| 353 | I just don't get this approach, which was supposedly to end the war quickly, | 我只是不明白这个方法, 这应该是为了迅速结束战争, |
| 354 | which now seems to be elongating it. | 它现在似乎在延长它。 |
| 355 | And in doing so, throwing up a smokescreen of very variable facts, | 在这样的时候, 吐出一个烟幕 非常多变的事实, |
| 356 | if they are facts at all, about how things occurred, | 如果他们是事实, 事情是如何发生的, |
| 357 | which actually isn't helping things. | 其实这帮不上忙 |
| 358 | And if people can't see that Putin is stalling, | 如果人们看不出普京在拖延时间 |
| 359 | I agree with you. | 我同意你的观点。 |
| 360 | I think he might be stalling. | 我觉得他在拖延时间 |
| 361 | And therefore, I think even your president has acknowledged the fact that he thinks he might be stalling. | 因此,我想连你的总统都承认 他觉得他可能会拖延时间 |
| 362 | That's correct. | 没错 |
| 363 | So we don't have a disagreement there. | 所以我们没有分歧 |
| 364 | No, we don't. | 不,我们没有。 |
| 365 | We just have a disagreement about the efficacy of tactics. | 我们只是对战术的效果有分歧。 |
| 366 | And we don't know. | 我们不知道。 |
| 367 | And I'm willing to say we could be wrong. | 我愿意说我们可能错了 |
| 368 | No. | 没有 |
| 369 | Of course you could be wrong in life. | 你当然会错的 |
| 370 | I mean, we could all be wrong. | 我的意思是,我们都可能是错的。 |
| 371 | But actually bringing that war to an end consistently actually isn't going very well. | 但实际上使战争持续结束 实际上并不是很顺利 |
| 372 | And I would just suggest to you that whatever tactics have been used are perhaps not the best. | 我建议你们,无论使用什么战术,也许不是最好的做法。 |
| 373 | And they are certainly inconsistent with what's going on in the Middle East | 他们肯定与中东的情况不符 |
| 374 | and how America has been treating parties in the Middle East. | 以及美国如何对待中东各方。 |
| 375 | But I've had enough of your time. | 但我已经受够了你的时间。 |
| 376 | No, that's a fair contention. | 不,这是公平的论点。 |
| 377 | Thank you very much. | 谢谢 |
| 378 | Thank you very much indeed. | 非常感谢 |
| 379 | Thank you everybody. | 谢谢大家 |
| 380 | Thank you. | 谢谢 |
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