实战练英文 | Charlie Kirk：女性何必上班，生儿
字幕摘录
| 时间 | 英文 | 中文 |
|---|---|---|
| 0:02 | Our next question is from Tilly Middlehurst at Fitzwilliam College, so I'm a feminist | 下一个问题来自菲茨威廉学院的Tilly Middlehurst 所以我是个女权主义者 |
| 0:16 | My question is about the role of women though | 我的问题是女人的作用 |
| 0:19 | What should women's role in public and private life look like and what are the material benefits of that? | 妇女在公共和私人生活中的角色应该是什么样子,其物质利益是什么? |
| 0:24 | Well, thank you for that. | 谢谢你 |
| 0:26 | Can I take it? | 我能接受吗? |
| 0:27 | I don't want to take this detour | 我不想绕道走 |
| 0:28 | But can we both agree on what a woman is? | 但我们能就女人是什么达成一致吗? |
| 0:30 | Yes an adult human female | 是的,成年人类女性 |
| 0:32 | It's a biological state of being that is also socially experienced. | 它是一种生物状态,在社会上也有经验. |
| 0:35 | Can I please elucidate just one example of that social experience? | 我能否仅列举一下这种社会经历的一个例子? |
展开字幕全文（169 条）
| 序号 | 英文 | 中文 |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | Our next question is from Tilly Middlehurst at Fitzwilliam College, so I'm a feminist | 下一个问题来自菲茨威廉学院的Tilly Middlehurst 所以我是个女权主义者 |
| 2 | My question is about the role of women though | 我的问题是女人的作用 |
| 3 | What should women's role in public and private life look like and what are the material benefits of that? | 妇女在公共和私人生活中的角色应该是什么样子,其物质利益是什么? |
| 4 | Well, thank you for that. | 谢谢你 |
| 5 | Can I take it? | 我能接受吗? |
| 6 | I don't want to take this detour | 我不想绕道走 |
| 7 | But can we both agree on what a woman is? | 但我们能就女人是什么达成一致吗? |
| 8 | Yes an adult human female | 是的,成年人类女性 |
| 9 | It's a biological state of being that is also socially experienced. | 它是一种生物状态,在社会上也有经验. |
| 10 | Can I please elucidate just one example of that social experience? | 我能否仅列举一下这种社会经历的一个例子? |
| 11 | I was gonna answer your question, but sure go ahead | 我本来想回答你的问题的,但请说 |
| 12 | So let's say you're a member of a tribe and that in that tribe to you have the biological female anatomy | 假设你是一个部落的成员 在那个部落里 你有一个生物女性解剖学 |
| 13 | And in order to become a woman in that tribe, you have to also get a tattoo | 为了成为那个部落中的女人,你还要纹身 |
| 14 | That's a social experience that's mapped onto biological reality | 这是一个社会经历,它被映射到生物现实中 |
| 15 | So can a woman have a prostate? | 所以女人能有前列腺吗? |
| 16 | Can a woman have a prostate? | 女人能有前列腺吗? |
| 17 | Biologically speaking a woman is an adult human female that has a biological reality | 从生物学上讲 女人是成年的人类女性 有生物现实 |
| 18 | But it's also social experience, right? | 但它也是社会经验,对不对? |
| 19 | So I like I don't it's super easy | 所以我喜欢的不是超容易的 |
| 20 | Like can a woman have a prostate as per my definition woman? | 像我定义的女性一样,女性能有前列腺吗? |
| 21 | I would say that people who have a prostate are biologically male, but they can sometimes be socially treated as women | 我想说,有前列腺的人在生理上是男性,但他们有时可以被社会视为女性。 |
| 22 | Okay, got it. | 好吧,来吧。 |
| 23 | So so so so women can have prostates. | 所以女人可以有前列腺 |
| 24 | Okay | 还好 |
| 25 | So you're a feminist that actually isn't just fighting for women. | 所以,你是一个女权主义者 实际上不只是为女人而战。 |
| 26 | You're also fighting for men. | 你也为男人而战 |
| 27 | So yes | 没错 |
| 28 | Yeah, men also experience harms from patriarchy, but I are you talking about the same feminism though. | 是啊,男人也经历 父权制的伤害, 但我说的是同样的女性主义。 |
| 29 | Just make sure you actually go ahead | 只要确保你确实去 |
| 30 | Men also experience harm from the patriarchal domination | 男子也因父权统治而受到伤害 |
| 31 | But I would argue that those harms come from that system of domination itself in the same way | 但我认为这些伤害 来自于统治制度本身 同样的方式 |
| 32 | For example, this isn't a threat | 例如,这不是威胁 |
| 33 | But if I reached across and punched you in the face, then my hand might hurt, right? | 但如果我伸手打你的脸 我的手可能会痛 对吧? |
| 34 | So are we understanding that there are dumb like patterns of power? | 所以,我们是否理解,有像愚蠢的权力模式? |
| 35 | So I would also fight for the rights of men as a feminist just as I would fight for the rights of women | 因此我也会为男人的权利而斗争 就像我为女人的权利而斗争一样 |
| 36 | You think women are happier than they were four years ago. | 你认为女人比四年前更快乐 |
| 37 | I think I would have a few responses to that | 我想我会得到一些回应 |
| 38 | I think that women report more stress and dissatisfaction today because not because they have more rights or because of feminism | 我认为,妇女今天报告更多的压力和不满,不是因为她们拥有更多的权利,也不是因为女性主义。 |
| 39 | But because they're under dual pressure to both excel professionally and also because of the domestic labor in homes that is structured around outdated expectations | 但是,因为他们受到双重压力 既专业优秀 也因为家务劳动 围绕过时的期望 |
| 40 | So for example studies like the OECD's better life index show that women's life expectancy education levels | 例如,经合组织的改善生活指数等研究表明,妇女的预期寿命教育水平 |
| 41 | Professional achievements have risen in countries with higher gender inequality | 在两性不平等程度较高的国家,专业成就有所提高 |
| 42 | So I would argue that what you're calling unhappiness is actually visibility because now we hear women expressing dissatisfaction | 所以我认为你所说的不幸福其实是能见度 因为现在我们听到女人表达不满 |
| 43 | Whereas in the 50s, we prescribed them Valium and we lobotomize | 五十年代的时候,我们给它们注射安定剂,然后去掉 |
| 44 | That's really rich I didn't know women not to complain 50 years ago, that's funny | 真有钱 我50年前就不知道女人不抱怨了 真好笑 |
| 45 | So hold on a second. | 所以请等一下。 |
| 46 | Why are suicide rates going up more for women? | 为什么女性自杀率会上升? |
| 47 | I think that complaining materially women are killing themselves more. | 我认为在物质上抱怨的妇女正在自杀。 |
| 48 | Why is that? | 为什么? |
| 49 | I think that even if both men both men and women have become unhappier men suicide rates have risen as well | 我认为,即使男人和女人都变得不愉快 自杀率也上升了 |
| 50 | And that's also been exponential. | 这也是指数化的。 |
| 51 | Can you at least concede that feminism offers only one potential explanation? | 你至少能承认 女性主义只有一个可能的解释吗? |
| 52 | There could be also other explanation | 还有其他解释 |
| 53 | Obviously, but feminism is the the glaring thing in front of us where we have fertility rates down | 显然,但女性主义是摆在我们面前的亮点 在那里我们生育率下降 |
| 54 | We have marriage rates down we have unhappiness up and we did something in the 1960s out of the universities of | 我们的婚姻率下降 我们感到不幸福 我们在1960年代做了一些事情 |
| 55 | Bretty Friedan和Gloria Steinem 以及所有这些女权主义者 基本上都说你被困在一个家里 | |
| 56 | Go get a job freeze your eggs take birth control and all of a sudden women are way | 去找份工作 冻死你的蛋 节育 突然间女人就成了 |
| 57 | Unhappier than they were 40 years ago, and I just have to ask the question | 比40年前更不高兴,我只好问一个问题 |
| 58 | Why is that is it working and maybe there are? | 为什么会这样呢? |
| 59 | Biological differences between men and women that we should respect and that deep down a lot of women want to get married and have children | 男人和女人之间的生理差异是我们应该尊重的 而在内心深处,很多女人想要结婚生孩子 |
| 60 | In fact, we should applaud it and we should support it and we should say it means nothing if you're gonna go be a CEO of | 事实上,我们应该鼓掌, 我们应该支持它, 我们应该说,这是没有意义 如果你要去做首席执行官 |
| 61 | Some shoe company or be some banker in London | 伦敦的鞋厂或者银行家 |
| 62 | What matters if you raise children and you have something to pass down lot long after you're gone? | 如果你抚养孩子 和你有东西 传递下来很多 你离开很久? |
| 63 | I think I would bring two points to that | 我想我会带两点 |
| 64 | The first one is just really simple which is that you can ascribe liberalism all you want as the cause of the unhappiness | 第一个很简单 就是你可以把自由主义 当作不幸福的原因 |
| 65 | I would argue something else. | 我会争论其他的。 |
| 66 | I would say that it's an economic policy that has very little to do with the social acceptance of alternative lifestyles | 我要说,这是一种经济政策,它与社会接受替代生活方式几乎没有关系。 |
| 67 | I would say that we can recognize that income inequality of across a vast swathe of Western countries has increased which causes all kinds of | 我要说,我们可以承认,整个广大西方国家的收入不平等有所加剧,造成各种各样的收入不平等。 |
| 68 | Social ills a lack of social cohesion housing price growth doesn't correspond with wage growth | 社会弊端 缺乏社会凝聚力 住房价格增长 不与工资增长相对应 |
| 69 | Monopolies increasingly become it kind of emboldened to interfere with politics and monopolies don't prioritize social health either | 垄断集团越来越胆大妄为 干预政治 垄断集团也不重视社会健康 |
| 70 | I think that those offer more compelling reasons for a decline in happiness than an increase in freedoms because just one more thing on an | 我认为,这提供了更令人信服的理由 导致幸福的下降 而不是自由的提高 因为只有一件事 |
| 71 | Intuitive basis generally speaking people want more freedom not less | 直觉基础一般说来人们想要更多的自由而不是更少的自由. |
| 72 | Okay, so if that's true, why is it? | 好吧,如果这是真的,为什么? |
| 73 | Do you do you agree that the happiest women of the West are married with kids? | 你同意西方最幸福的女人 和孩子结婚吗? |
| 74 | Um, I would have to look into it, but I think there are certain | 嗯,我不得不调查, 但我认为有把握 |
| 75 | Objectively, we know that right the women with kids are not the ones carrying down statues, right? | 客观地说,我们知道,正确的女人 有孩子的人不是 那些携带雕像的人,对不对? |
| 76 | They're the ones that actually have obligations tearing down statues correspond to some kind of smiles per capita data set that I wasn't | 他们实际上有义务拆掉雕像 与某种微笑 人均数据集,我不是 |
| 77 | aware of again | 再说一遍 |
| 78 | It's like it's a little bit of a one-liner | 好像有点单线 |
| 79 | the happy and the grateful | 快乐和感激 |
| 80 | The happy and the grateful usually don't go burn down Wendy's in their spare time of which we saw in our country all throughout | 快乐和感激的人 通常不会在温蒂的空余时间里 烧掉温蒂的 |
| 81 | A single summer | 一个夏天 |
| 82 | But as a side note you would agree objectively study after study survey after survey | 但作为旁白,你会同意客观的学习 调查之后的研究 |
| 83 | That the women of the West that are married and have children especially a lot of children are for happier than even the ones that earn | 西方的已婚和有孩子的妇女, 特别是很多孩子, 比那些挣钱的妇女更幸福。 |
| 84 | More money correlated at the same age | 更多钱在同年龄相关 |
| 85 | So I also don't think that happiness is a very good metric and neither do you because you think gay people shouldn't just pursue happiness by | 所以我也不认为幸福是一个非常好的衡量标准 你也不是 因为你认为同性恋者不应该仅仅追求幸福 |
| 86 | Being gay they have other moralistic considerations to be making so I don't think smiles per capita is a particularly convincing way to measure | 作为同性恋 他们还有其他道德考虑 所以我不认为 笑容是衡量 |
| 87 | Whether or not we should encourage women to be autonomous | 我们是否应鼓励妇女自主 |
| 88 | I think we should maximize agency within a fair system that has reasonable parameters because it's expedient. | 我认为我们应该在一个有合理参数的公平体系中最大限度地发挥机构的作用,因为它是权宜之计。 |
| 89 | It's good for the economy | 对经济有好处 |
| 90 | It's logical | 这是合乎逻辑的 |
| 91 | It's the moral thing because if we can't prove the material harms we shouldn't discourage it and also self-reported studies is a really flawed way | 这是道德问题 因为如果我们不能证明物质上的伤害 我们不应该阻止它 并且自报的研究 是一个真的有缺陷的方法 |
| 92 | To do psychology is the week before my university exams right now | 做心理学的是我大学考试的前一周 |
| 93 | And I'm standing here explaining the basic basic methodology behind survey collection in sociology | 我站在这里解释社会学调查收集的基本方法 |
| 94 | But you don't even think is a real subject to Charlie Kirk if I took one of those surveys right now | 但你甚至不认为 查理・柯克是一个真正的课题 如果我现在接受这些调查之一 |
| 95 | I check extremely miserable, but so would a Palestinian child who's been taunted smithereens. | 我检查了极其悲惨的, 但一个巴勒斯坦孩子,谁被吓坏了。 |
| 96 | How are we going to say extremely miserable? | 我们该怎么说呢? |
| 97 | No, I'm kind of making a joke. | 不,我在开玩笑 |
| 98 | No, I mean, but it's here like | 不,我的意思是,但它在这里就像 |
| 99 | But hold on I mean like that's an important point though | 但坚持住,我的意思是,像 这是一个重要点,虽然 |
| 100 | Is that the women in the West have it the best in the world and yet? | 西方女人有世上最好的吗? |
| 101 | They're way unhappier than women of Sub-Saharan Africa | 他们比撒哈拉以南的非洲女人更不高兴 |
| 102 | There's something phenomenally wrong here because the women of Sub-Saharan Africa have something that a lot of women the West do not have | 这里有些大错特错 因为撒哈拉沙漠以南的非洲妇女 拥有很多西方没有的东西 |
| 103 | The women the West have cats and they have good jobs and the women of Sub-Saharan Africa | 西方女人有猫 有好工作 还有撒哈拉以南非洲女人 |
| 104 | They have a belief in the divine and they have kids and maybe there's a biological undercurrent that is keeping a lot of women | 他们相信神,他们有孩子 也许有生物的潜流 保存着很多女人 |
| 105 | from | 从 |
| 106 | Realizing their full potential and so without reading your phone and just like you know connecting | 充分发挥他们的潜力 所以不读你的手机 就像你知道连接 |
| 107 | Well, you it's fine sure then you can answer without it fair enough | 好吧,你确定,那么你可以回答 没有足够公平 |
| 108 | Would you agree that it's a good thing that more women get married and have children in the West? | 你是否同意在西方有更多的女人结婚生子是件好事? |
| 109 | I would ask you would you say that a Sub-Saharan African woman who's experienced female genital mutilation and checks extremely happy in a survey? | 我问你,一个撒哈拉以南的非洲妇女 经历了女性生殖器切割 和检查非常快乐 在一次调查? |
| 110 | I also would check extremely happy in a survey here | 我也会在这里调查一下 非常高兴 |
| 111 | Do you think would be objectively more happy even if they both checked the same answer no again? | 你是否认为客观上会更快乐 即使他们都检查了同样的答案 不再? |
| 112 | So I full if you want to talk about how Islam mistreats women we could talk all day long like I'm all for that | 所以,我饱了,如果你想谈 伊斯兰教如何虐待妇女 我们可以整天交谈,就像我的一切 |
| 113 | We do okay good, so we agree | 我们做得很好,所以我们同意 |
| 114 | We should shut off Muslim immigration to the UK right we totally agree | 我们应该关闭穆斯林移民到英国 我们完全同意 |
| 115 | I think that all religious fundamentalism is bad and if you take that logic we should also not allow evangelical Christians | 我认为所有宗教原教旨主义都是坏的 如果你接受这个逻辑 我们也不应允许福音派基督徒 |
| 116 | Okay, hold on hold on a second | 好,等一会 |
| 117 | Can you show me a single? | 能给我看张单曲吗? |
| 118 | What would your example because I have 50 of a single Christian country that you would say mistreats women right Erica | 以你为例 因为我有50个基督教国家 你会说虐待女人 |
| 119 | Oh, really we missed we had a female woman vice president | 哦,我们真的错过了 我们有一个女性副总统 |
| 120 | We had a female vice president a female speaker of the house women earn more than men in America | 我们有个女副总统 一个女演说家 美国女人比男人挣得更多 |
| 121 | Rowan in Rwanda female representation in government out out seeds like supersedes the UK by quite a lot | 卢旺达的Rowan 女性在政府中的代表 淘汰出种子,比如 取代英国很多。 |
| 122 | Do women get treated better in Rwanda? | 在卢旺达,妇女是否得到更好的待遇? |
| 123 | Okay is I might be super off this like there was Rwanda Islamic like I'm not totally sure | 好吧,我可能会是超级 这一点,就像有卢旺达伊斯兰 像我不完全确定 |
| 124 | I don't think it is like is it like I don't know actually I don't it's not so again | 我不觉得这就像我不知道 其实我不认为它是如此再次 |
| 125 | We're just about Islam is a little bit of side note | 我们只是关于伊斯兰教的 一点点旁白 |
| 126 | but you must be morally clear because you brought up female gentleman relation which is a | 但你必须讲明道德 因为你提起了 女性绅士关系,这是一个 |
| 127 | Teaching of the Islamic faith, but as a side note like again. | 教伊斯兰信仰,但作为一个副记号再次出现. |
| 128 | This is very important | 这很重要 |
| 129 | Which is I'm not here to require you to do anything or not | 我不是来要求你做任何事的 |
| 130 | I'm making a simple observation which is which is objectively true regardless the women of the West are miserable | 我做了一个简单的观察, 客观上是真实的, 不管西方的女人是悲惨的 |
| 131 | And they're miserable for a reason because we've told them to suppress how they are made by God and pursue something else and get a bunch | 他们很痛苦,因为我们已经告诉他们 压制他们是如何由上帝制造的 并追求其他东西,得到一堆 |
| 132 | Of trinkets and get a bunch of promotions and they end up at 38 years old with a big flat in London | 他们在伦敦有个大公寓,38岁就升职了 |
| 133 | And they're miserable and we should tell them to stop freezing their eggs and start finding their partner earlier and have lots of babies | 而且他们很悲惨,我们应该告诉他们 停止冻结他们的鸡蛋 并开始找到他们的伴侣 并有很多孩子 |
| 134 | Yeah, okay | 是啊,还好 |
| 135 | I think I bring two just final points to this first one is just really intuitive right which is that if you actually care | 我觉得我给这第一个带了两个最后的一点 只是非常直觉的权利,那就是如果你真的在乎 |
| 136 | About women's happiness then the solution is to structurally support them that means universal child care shared legally enforceable parents will leave | 关于女性的幸福,解决方案是从结构上支持她们,这意味着普及由法律强制实施的儿童照料父母将离开 |
| 137 | And in Nordic countries where women have high workforce participation and also some states support their report higher alive | 在北欧国家,妇女劳动力参与率很高,有些州还支持她们的报告,认为她们活得更高。 |
| 138 | Satisfaction than in more conservative countries including America, so if your metric is just you satisfaction | 比包括美国在内的保守国家满意 如果你的衡量标准只是满意 |
| 139 | Yes, so our satisfaction | 是的,所以我们的满意 |
| 140 | Do you acknowledge satisfaction surveys or not just told me that they're BS. | 你承认满意调查还是不告诉我他们是BS |
| 141 | Do you think they're objective we can use that as data | 你觉得他们是客观的 我们可以用它做数据 |
| 142 | I don't think that it is the only soul data set, but it is | 我不认为这是唯一的灵魂数据集,但它是 |
| 143 | You told me there's a flawed and you self-report, okay, but by the macro self self-satisfaction data | 你告诉我有一个缺陷 你自我报告,好吗, 但宏观自我满足数据 |
| 144 | I am correct, and you are right when you have paid family leave you are happier | 我说得对,你是对的 当你付了家事假,你更快乐 |
| 145 | I'm actually a proponent of that at turning point you say we pay for six months when somebody has a child | 我其实是那个转折点的支持者 你说当有人有孩子的时候 我们付六个月 |
| 146 | I think there's a lot of agreement we can have on that we need to encourage having more children | 我想我们可以达成很多协议 我们需要鼓励多生孩子 |
| 147 | I think the Hungarian child policy is phenomenal | 我认为匈牙利儿童政策是惊人的 |
| 148 | We should look at that because the greatest thing that is plaguing the West is we're not having enough kids | 我们应该看看,因为最伟大的事情是 困扰西方是,我们没有足够的孩子 |
| 149 | And it's not just bad because we won't have a future | 这不光是因为我们没有未来 |
| 150 | It's also bad because the present is awfully miserable for too many women as well | 也不好 因为现在对太多女人来说 也太悲惨了 |
| 151 | Okay, in which case I think we get do I start bring this to a close place, okay? | 好吧,如果这样的话,我想我们得到 我开始把这个地方关闭,好吗? |
| 152 | Just one final thing which is that in which case we get to a really interesting argument about what kind of what parts of womanhood | 最后一件事是,在这种情况下,我们得到 一个真正有趣的争论 关于什么样的 女人部分 |
| 153 | Can be demarcated to the social and what kinds of women who can be demarcated to biological so for example my anatomy is demarcated | 可以标注在社会上 以及什么样的女性 可以标注在生物上 比如我的解剖学 |
| 154 | To the biological but the fact that I might potentially be a better nurture than a man | 但事实上我可能比男人更能养育 |
| 155 | I would demarcate that to the social you might demarcate that to the biological in which case we have differing moral scales of value | 我将标注在社会上 你可能标注在生物学上,在这种情况下,我们有不同的道德价值 |
| 156 | I would ask why we should necessarily prioritize your moral scale of value which prioritizes things like the birth rate when in | 我想问为什么我们一定要优先考虑你的道德价值 优先考虑出生率 |
| 157 | Actual fact there are various other moral scales of value, and if you yourself are free market American | 事实上,还有其他各种道德价值尺度,如果你自己是自由市场美国人 |
| 158 | Is it the case that you would not like the previous speaker | 难道你不喜欢前一位发言者吗? |
| 159 | when a society stops having kids to replace their own population and then | 当一个社会不再有孩子来代替自己的人口,然后 |
| 160 | You have to import the third world and you become the third world. | 得入三世而为三世. |
| 161 | It's bad. | 恶之. |
| 162 | I disagree, but thank you. | 我不同意,但谢谢你。 |
| 163 | Okay. | 摆 |
| 164 | Thank you | 谢谢 |
| 165 | And it's absolutely wrong and bad when a society stops having kids to replace their own population | 当一个社会不再有孩子来代替自己的人口时,这是完全错误和糟糕的 |
| 166 | And then you have to import the third world and you become the third world. | 然后得进口三世而成三世. |
| 167 | It's bad. | 恶之. |
| 168 | I disagree, but thank you | 我不同意,但谢谢你 |
| 169 | Okay, thank you. | 好的 谢谢 |
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