【英音】关于临床医学家的真相 | Francis Madde
字幕摘录
| 时间 | 英文 | 中文 |
|---|---|---|
| 0:06 | This is a clinical psychologist. | 这是临床心理学家 |
| 0:07 | I asked him about his job, including the best and the worst | 我问他的工作,包括最好的和最坏的 |
| 0:10 | bits. | 位数。 |
| 0:10 | If you're new here, my name is Francis. | 如果你是新来的 我叫弗朗西斯 |
| 0:12 | For the past year, I've been working on a master's | 一年来,我一直在研究一个大师 |
| 0:14 | placement in a child and adolescent mental health service in the NHS, and I'm about to start the | 安置在国民保健体系的儿童和青少年精神健康服务机构,我即将开始 |
| 0:19 | clinical psychology doctorate at Oxford. | 牛津大学临床心理学博士。 |
| 0:21 | After pestering most of the staff members at work, | 在骚扰了大部分工作人员后, |
| 0:24 | 我采访了我的主管,Emmanuel。 | |
| 0:26 | Emmanuel has been a clinical psychologist for over a decade | 埃马纽埃尔十几年来一直是临床心理学家 |
展开字幕全文（170 条）
| 序号 | 英文 | 中文 |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | This is a clinical psychologist. | 这是临床心理学家 |
| 2 | I asked him about his job, including the best and the worst | 我问他的工作,包括最好的和最坏的 |
| 3 | bits. | 位数。 |
| 4 | If you're new here, my name is Francis. | 如果你是新来的 我叫弗朗西斯 |
| 5 | For the past year, I've been working on a master's | 一年来,我一直在研究一个大师 |
| 6 | placement in a child and adolescent mental health service in the NHS, and I'm about to start the | 安置在国民保健体系的儿童和青少年精神健康服务机构,我即将开始 |
| 7 | clinical psychology doctorate at Oxford. | 牛津大学临床心理学博士。 |
| 8 | After pestering most of the staff members at work, | 在骚扰了大部分工作人员后, |
| 9 | 我采访了我的主管,Emmanuel。 | |
| 10 | Emmanuel has been a clinical psychologist for over a decade | 埃马纽埃尔十几年来一直是临床心理学家 |
| 11 | and therefore knows a hell of a lot more about this field than I do. | 比我更了解这个领域 |
| 12 | I learned a lot from him | 我从他那里学到了很多 |
| 13 | during this interview, even though I did it after finishing most of my masters and getting on to | 在这次采访中,尽管我完成了大部分的主人 并开始 |
| 14 | the doctorate. | 博士学位。 |
| 15 | So I'm confident this will help at least one of you if you have any interest whatsoever | 所以我相信这至少能帮助你们中的一个人 如果你有任何兴趣的话 |
| 16 | in this field. | 在这个领域。 |
| 17 | So without further ado, I give you Emmanuel. | 因此,不做更多的事, 我给你埃马纽埃尔。 |
| 18 | Do you want to introduce yourself? | 你想自我介绍一下吗? |
| 19 | Sure. | 当然 |
| 20 | How are you? | 你好吗? |
| 21 | So my name is Emmanuel Steele and I am a clinical psychologist. | 我叫艾曼纽尔·斯蒂尔 我是个临床心理学家 |
| 22 | What is a clinical psychologist? | 什么是临床心理学家? |
| 23 | How would you summarize the job role? | 你怎么总结工作角色? |
| 24 | A clinical psychologist | 一个临床心理学家 |
| 25 | is first and foremost a therapist, so someone who provides therapeutic input to a client. | 首先是一个治疗师, 所以有人谁提供 治疗输入给客户。 |
| 26 | But a | 不过 |
| 27 | clinical psychologist differs from other therapists in that we use evidence-based models to help our | 临床心理学家与其他治疗师不同之处在于 我们使用基于证据的模型来帮助我们 |
| 28 | clients overcome mental health difficulties. | 客户克服了心理健康方面的困难。 |
| 29 | What was it about clinical psychology that appealed | 是什么关于临床心理学 上诉 |
| 30 | to you? | 对你? |
| 31 | I think it is the overlap between obviously the therapeutic bit, which is about being able to | 我认为是治疗部分的重叠, 也就是能够 |
| 32 | contain someone, contain their anxiety, their worries, the emotions that are brought up in a | 控制一个人,控制他们的焦虑,他们的担心, 情绪,在一种 |
| 33 | session, to be genuine, non-judgmental, to convey a sense of genuine care towards your client. | 来表达对客户的关心 |
| 34 | Alongside that is obviously the fact that you use evidence-based and objectively measurable | 除此之外,显然你使用基于证据和客观可测量的 |
| 35 | interventions. | 干预。 |
| 36 | That feels like the right place to be in personally as a practitioner, but also | 感觉像一个合适的地方 个人作为一个实践者,但也 |
| 37 | for the clients because obviously given that it's measurable, you can see whether an intervention | 对于客户来说,因为很明显,考虑到这是可以衡量的, 你可以看到是否干预 |
| 38 | is yielding success or not. | 成功与否。 |
| 39 | And if not, then you look into a different modality. | 如果不是,你就会寻找另一种模式。 |
| 40 | You can reassess | 你可以重新评估 |
| 41 | whether contextual factors are at play or are you indeed addressing the right issue? | 你是否确实在讨论正确的问题? |
| 42 | Is the diagnosis | 是诊断 |
| 43 | the right one? | 正确的一个? |
| 44 | A common question that I had before deciding I wanted to get into this was as you | 之前我有一个共同的问题 我想进入这个 像你一样 |
| 45 | touched on, how does clinical psychology differ from other therapies? | 临床心理学与其他疗法有何不同? |
| 46 | You could be a psychotherapist, | 你可能是一个心理治疗师, |
| 47 | you could be like a CBT therapist, which is separate, but also clinical psychology has CBT | 你可能像一个CBT治疗师, 这是独立的, 但也临床心理学有CBT |
| 48 | within it and all the other types of therapy. | 在它和所有其他类型的治疗。 |
| 49 | So I guess how would you summarize how it's different? | 所以,我想你会如何总结 它是如何不同的? |
| 50 | I think it is the ability to be integrative in your approach in that you do not have to rigidly | 我认为这是融入你的方法的能力 因为在你不必僵硬 |
| 51 | stick to a model and CBT will be the preferred model for most therapists. | CBT是大多数治疗师的首选模式。 |
| 52 | As a clinical psychologist | 作为临床心理学家 |
| 53 | you'll be well-schooled in CBT, but I think the richness of being a clinical psychologist is that | 你会在CBT接受良好的教育 但我认为当临床心理学家的丰富之处在于 |
| 54 | 也可以集成 MBT 或 DBT。 | |
| 55 | Any modality you have either trained in as part of your | 任何你训练过的方式 |
| 56 | training to become a clinical psychologist or as part of your continual professional development. | 训练成为临床心理学家或作为你持续的专业发展的一部分。 |
| 57 | Sometimes the evidence suggests that a certain modality is the right way forward for that specific | 有时,有证据表明,某种方式是推进这一特定方式的正确途径。 |
| 58 | mental health difficulty and in these cases if the young person or if the client responds well to | 心理健康方面的困难,以及在这种情况下,如果年轻人或委托人对下列情况反应良好: |
| 59 | that treatment you'd be advised to stick to obviously the modality itself. | 那个治疗方法你应该坚持 很明显的方式本身。 |
| 60 | When you say | 当你说 |
| 61 | evidence-based I feel like someone would argue that you know if they're in a psychodynamic modality | 以证据为基础 我觉得有人会说 你知道如果他们在心理动力学模式下 |
| 62 | then they would say well there's evidence for this like therapy there's evidence for every therapy | 他们就会说有证据可以证明这种治疗 有证据可以证明每一种治疗 |
| 63 | I guess like what makes it like more evidence-based to be a clinical psychologist? | 做一个临床心理学家是什么感觉? |
| 64 | I think it is in the in the measure of the outcome the fact that we would use questionnaire | 我认为,根据结果,我们将使用问卷。 |
| 65 | psychometric assessment tools to measure the progress you know objectively there is obviously | 客观上衡量进展的心理测量评估工具显然 |
| 66 | the subjective parts there is your own kind of clinical judgment but there is also the | 主观部分是你自己的临床判断 但也有 |
| 67 | psychometric assessment tools there is that kind of measurable progress to you know fall back on. | 心理测量评估工具 那种可以衡量的进展 你知道会回落。 |
| 68 | How would you describe like what your job is? | 你会怎样描述你的工作? |
| 69 | Most of my experience as I said has been with children and adolescents as part of what is | 正如我所说,我的大部分经验都是与儿童和青少年打交道的,作为他们的一部分 |
| 70 | called this single point of access we triage referrals conduct assessments we meet with the | 我们分门别类的转诊进行评估 |
| 71 | young persons we meet with the families and then develop a care plan which addresses the | 我们会见这些家庭的年轻人,然后制定照顾计划,解决儿童的问题。 |
| 72 | difficulties and so my job consists of listening to the wishes of the young person and the family | 我的工作就是倾听年轻人和家人的愿望 |
| 73 | but also thinking clinically in terms of which modality would be the best suited to address the | 并且从临床角度思考哪种模式最适合解决 |
| 74 | difficulties that the young person presents with and how do you think through that and like make | 年轻人面临的困难 以及你如何思考 |
| 75 | sense of all the information a young person provides and I guess it's so different between | 感觉一个年轻人提供的所有信息 我想它是如此不同 |
| 76 | it is it is and I guess that's what makes the job really interesting every young person that you meet | 这是它,我想这就是 使得这个工作 真正有趣的每一个年轻人 你遇到 |
| 77 | brings a different story every individual is unique I will often be you know the first contact | 给每个人带来不同的故事 每个个体都是独一无二的 我常常会是你知道第一个接触者 |
| 78 | that a young person may have with therapeutic services so it's important to be able to establish | 年轻人可能得到治疗服务,所以重要的是能够建立 |
| 79 | rapport to you know make the young person feel hurt in a genuine way in a non-judgmental way | 和你知道的亲情 使年轻人真正感到伤害 以非判断的方式 |
| 80 | and then obviously agree with them you know what next steps are in order what's a typical day like | 然后很明显地同意他们的意见 你知道接下来的步骤是什么 才算一个典型的日子 |
| 81 | for you encounters at nine o'clock we would start the day with going through the referrals that we | 因为你们在9点碰面 我们从今天开始 接受我们推荐 |
| 82 | have received the day before we have prioritized young persons who are more at risk so we would | 在前一天,我们优先照顾那些面临更大风险的年轻人,以便我们 |
| 83 | then try and get a hold of the young person or the family and have the family to mitigate the risk | 然后试着联系年轻人或家庭,让家庭减轻风险 |
| 84 | formulating with them a safety plan we would then establish contact with the other young persons | 与他们制定安全计划,然后与其他年轻人建立联系 |
| 85 | that have been referred to us to speak to them if possible or speak to their families get a sense of | 如果可能的话,或与家人交谈, |
| 86 | of what the context is what the risk is and what the presentation may be that the young person | 说明什么是背景 是什么是风险 是什么可能是年轻人 |
| 87 | struggles with if possible we would signpost the young person to the appropriate service there and | 如果可能的话,我们会把年轻人签到 合适的服务那里, |
| 88 | then but if there is a need for an assessment to be offered then we would offer the first | 但是如果需要评估的话,我们会提供第一个 |
| 89 | availability once triage and the necessary calls have been made we would usually go into | 一旦分门别类和必要的电话发出,我们通常会进入 |
| 90 | assessments so we would have an assessment in the morning and an assessment in the afternoon they | 因此,我们将在上午进行评估,下午进行评估。 |
| 91 | are 90 minutes but they you know can exceed that time or sometimes it can be briefer we would meet | 90分钟,但他们知道可以超过这个时间, 或者有时它可以更简短的,我们会见面 |
| 92 | with the family we would meet it with the young person we would go through you know the context | 和家人一起 我们会和我们经历的年轻人见面 你知道背景 |
| 93 | history family history we would conduct a mental state examination we would look at risk we would | 历史 家族历史 我们会进行精神状态检查 我们会研究风险 |
| 94 | address you know the the areas of their lives which need to be addressed and then together with | 你们知道他们生活中需要解决的领域,然后与 |
| 95 | them agree on what the next step ought to be we listen to their wishes but we also have to think | 他们同意下一步应该是什么 我们倾听他们的愿望 但我们也必须思考 |
| 96 | clinically in terms of what the best next step should be between assessments we would usually | 在临床上,从下一步的最佳步骤是 评估之间,我们通常会 |
| 97 | reach out to other services that we work with for the majority that would be making calls to | 与我们合作的多数人 |
| 98 | social workers but we also liaise with schools sometimes set up meetings | 社工,我们有时也会和学校联络 |
| 99 | multidisciplinary meetings social services school sometimes police can be present in order to you | 社会服务学校有时可以派警察来接待你们 |
| 100 | know make sure that the young person is safe and and well supported there is space perhaps for | 要知道确保年轻人是安全的 并得到很好的支持 也许还有空间 |
| 101 | another assessment in the afternoon a lot of the work consists of administrative tasks unfortunately | 下午的另一项评估 大部分工作都是行政任务 |
| 102 | there's lots of typing up of notes writing referral letters written communication with | 有很多笔记打字 写转介信 与 |
| 103 | partners that we have so other services that we work with that could be colleagues you know from | 伙伴们,我们有其他的服务,我们合作的 同事,你知道从。 |
| 104 | different services with incomes what is the best part of your role the privilege i have establishing | 不同服务与收入 最好的部分你的角色 我所赋予的特权 |
| 105 | a relationship with the young persons who come and seek help often i will be the first interaction | 和来寻求帮助的年轻人的关系 经常是我第一次互动 |
| 106 | these young persons have with mental health services i feel you know extremely privileged | 这些年轻人有精神保健服务... ...我觉得你知道... ... |
| 107 | to be able to listen to the stories they bring create a formulation together with them and | 能够聆听他们带来的故事 创造出一种配方 |
| 108 | understanding as to what has happened in your life that has led to these difficulties you know | 理解你生活中所发生的 导致这些困难 |
| 109 | most of the young persons who come to see me tend to think there's something wrong with them i'm | 大多数来看我的年轻人 都觉得他们有问题 |
| 110 | worthless i'm not good enough weak an assessment helps to externalize that and and helps the young | 没用的,我不够弱 评估有助于外部化 并帮助年轻人 |
| 111 | person understand the rationale what has happened that has shifted the way i think about myself | 人们明白发生的事 改变了我对自己的看法 |
| 112 | about my relationships with loved ones and and my place in the world that can be something really | 关于我和亲人的关系 还有我在世界中的地位 |
| 113 | cathartic uh for for these young persons when the young person leaves the assessment feeling | 对年轻人来说,当年轻人离开评估的感觉 |
| 114 | that they they kind of get that they're not to blame that there's nothing wrong with them but | 他们得到的,他们不怪 他们没有什么错,但 |
| 115 | that events have happened in their lives which have impacted their self-esteem the way they | 发生在他们生活中的事件 影响了他们的自尊 |
| 116 | think about themselves you know having a good first experience is also inviting for them to | 想想自己 你知道有良好的第一次经验 也是邀请他们 |
| 117 | take up the support thereafter believe in the process and the possible outcomes what about | 其后获得支持,相信进程和可能的结果如何 |
| 118 | the worst part of the job or least yeah least best i don't know if there's a worst part but | 工作最糟糕的部分 或者至少是的 最好的我不知道有没有最糟糕的部分 |
| 119 | it's difficult because sometimes despite our best efforts we are not able to sufficiently help | 这很困难,因为有时尽管我们尽了最大努力,我们仍无法提供足够的帮助 |
| 120 | a young person because there is a context uh that is out of our reach it can be frustrating having | 一个年轻人,因为有一个背景... ... ...... |
| 121 | to tell a young person or a family they'll sit on a waiting list for a long time before the actual | 告诉一个年轻人或者一个家庭 他们将会在等待名单上坐很久 才开始 |
| 122 | therapy can can um can happen or that somehow they do not meet the threshold that's something | 治疗可以,嗯 可能发生,或者,不知怎么 他们没有达到阈值 |
| 123 | i find um quite difficult in a job i do is is feeling that perhaps sometimes due to a lack | 我发现工作很困难 我觉得有时 可能因为缺乏 |
| 124 | of resources um the the weight is too long or that the help which is available is a long way away | 资源,嗯,重量太长 或者,可用的帮助是很远的 |
| 125 | how does being a clinical psychologist in the private sector compare to yeah nhs doesn't | 如何做一个临床心理学家 在私营部门 比较是的nhs |
| 126 | necessarily differ that much because you can decide to either be part of a clinic or you could be a | 一定有不同,因为你可以决定 要么是诊所的一部分,要么是... |
| 127 | therapist that practices individually i would say if you decide to to have your own private | 心理治疗师 个人练习的,我会说 如果你决定拥有自己的私人 |
| 128 | practice then things do differ quite starkly from being part of the NHS because within the NHS you | 因为你们在NHS中 |
| 129 | will always be part of a team in that sense it's just more pleasant you know it's more containing | 永远是团队的一部分 在这个意义上 它只是更愉快 你知道它更内含 |
| 130 | there are different perspectives if you know most teams will have multiple professional backgrounds | 如果你知道大多数球队会有多种职业背景, 观点就会不同 |
| 131 | which always enriches you know your understanding of the case or the ability to move forward it's | 总是能丰富你对案件的理解 或是推进的能力 |
| 132 | just a richness in being part of a team but when you then practice by yourself individually i think | 不过当你独自练习的时候 我想 |
| 133 | the things that you need to be mindful of is to make sure that you're not isolated you have you | 你需要注意的就是 确保自己不被孤立 |
| 134 | know decent clinical supervision or that you're somehow part of a network you can refer clients | 要知道良好的临床监督 或者你是网络的一部分 你可以推荐客户 |
| 135 | to colleagues into different settings as clinically appropriate or required having spoken to many | 与许多人交谈后, |
| 136 | colleagues who have private practices that is the one thing that keeps on coming up is this sense of | 有私人做法的同事们 总是有这种感觉 |
| 137 | being quite isolated i didn't realize that in private practice i guess you don't have like the | 相当孤立,我不知道 在私人练习中 我想你没有像 |
| 138 | team a multidisciplinary team so you just have yourself and then a supervisor i guess you find | 组一个多学科小组 这样你就能拥有自己 然后是主管 |
| 139 | privately there's many different settings you have that setting whereby you are a clinician by yourself | 私下里有很多不同的环境 你有一个环境,你是一个临床医生 |
| 140 | in private practice you can join a practice with other colleagues and they do not need to be you | 私下练习 你可以跟其他同事一起练习 他们不需要你 |
| 141 | know clinical psychologists all of them yeah you could be a psychiatrist part of that clinic they | 认识临床心理学家 他们全都是 对 你可以成为心理医生的一部分 在诊所 |
| 142 | be a clinical nurse specialist as part of that team there could be therapists schooled in different | 成为一名临床护士专家 作为团队的一部分 可能会有不同的治疗师 |
| 143 | modalities and that's that's a richness if you find yourself in that setting i would i would think | 模式,这就是一个丰富的 如果你发现自己 在那个背景下,我会认为 |
| 144 | that's the gold standard because you you have maybe more flexibility in working privately but | 这是金本位,因为你也许有 更大的灵活性 私人工作,但 |
| 145 | you're not by yourself there are hospitals you know privately run hospitals that you can join | 你不是一个人 有医院 你知道私人经营的医院 你可以加入 |
| 146 | within that hospital it you know the pathways will mimic pathways of the nhs often and you will find | 在医院里,你知道路径 会模仿Nh的路径,你会发现 |
| 147 | most professionals tend to work both within the nhs and then see clients privately as as is you | 大部分的专业人士都喜欢在nhs内部工作,然后像你们一样私下看待客户. |
| 148 | know the case for me you've been working in this service for is it five years at this point where | 你在这个部门工作了5年 |
| 149 | do you see your career going in the future i think one of my wishes would be to find a way to scale | 你看见你的事业未来会发展下去吗? 我认为我的愿望之一 就是找到一种方法来扩大 |
| 150 | the support so i tremendously enjoy helping my clients overcome the challenges that hold them | 帮助客户克服挑战 |
| 151 | from living a more fulfilling life yeah but it is a slow process it is on a one-to-one | 是的,但它是一个缓慢的过程 它在一对一。 |
| 152 | i believe technology offers an answer in terms of bridging the gap between the demands that | 我认为,技术在弥合需求之间的差距方面提供了答案。 |
| 153 | cannot be met currently and obviously the you know the help that is available i believe that | 目前无法满足 很明显你知道的帮助,我认为 |
| 154 | in the future there will be much more technological advances or digital interventions that will merge | 未来将有更多的技术进步或数字干预 |
| 155 | with you know clinical psychology or therapeutic interventions this is a direction i would like to | 你知道临床心理学或治疗性干预 这个方向我想 |
| 156 | grow into what would you say to someone who is thinking of becoming a clinical psychologist | 成长成你会对一个 想成为临床心理学家的人说什么 |
| 157 | and getting into the field anything they should bear in mind it is a very worthwhile and satisfying | 并获得任何他们应该记住的东西 这是一个非常值得和满足的 |
| 158 | job there is professionally no greater feeling than being able to help someone overcome their | 职业上没有什么比帮助别人克服 |
| 159 | challenges you will be in a very privileged position being part of your your clients lives | 作为你的客户的一部分 你将处于非常特殊的地位 |
| 160 | in a very intimate way but i think that as advice that i would like to give is making sure that there | 以非常亲密的方式,但我认为,作为我想给予的建议 是要确保那里 |
| 161 | are around you other colleagues supervisors part of your network so that you minimize the sense of | 在你身边,其他同事的主管 是你的网络的一部分, 这样你就可以尽量减少感 |
| 162 | isolation and also prepare yourself that's whilst it is a beautiful profession it's also a very | 孤立和准备自己 虽然这是一个美丽的职业 |
| 163 | demanding one you will not be able to help everyone but despite your best efforts there | 要求一个你无法帮助每个人,但尽管你尽了最大的努力 |
| 164 | will be clients that do not benefit from the intervention who may worsen whilst you are trying | 将会是无法从干预中受益的客户 在你尝试时可能会恶化 |
| 165 | to support them to understand and accept that this is part of the job and it doesn't reflect | 支持他们理解和接受 这是工作的一部分 并不反映 |
| 166 | on your ability as a professional thanks again to emmanuel for taking the time to be interviewed by | 再次感谢英马努尔抽出时间接受采访 |
| 167 | my amateur journalism podcasting skills if you're new to my channel i make videos about uni | 我的业余新闻播客技巧 如果你刚来我的频道 我拍关于uni的视频 |
| 168 | psychology clinical psychology so subscribe if those things are up your streets and i will see | 如果那些东西在你街上 我会看 |
| 169 | you very soon with another video go to ask the question again yeah just press stop what was | 很快,你用另一个视频去问 再次的问题。 |
| 170 | okay | 还好 |
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